"Pirate Legends are all jerks!"

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    ....I frequently hear this. "Pirate Legends are jerks" or some variation of the last word. OK. I understand the logic. PLs are people who don't need the loot for rep, and yet they fight for it anyway. As a PL, let me offer an alternative theory.

    It is approximated that it takes around 250 hours of gameplay to reach Pirate Legend. In that 250 hours, a pirate will have been betrayed any number of times, and eventually they get to the point where enough is enough.

    I was always the friendly pirate...the "let's be friends and sail together" pirate. I was rarely betrayed. As the percentage of betrayal began to exceed the percentage of friendship though, I began to become more mistrusting... more cautious... and less willing to help "friendly" crews.

    I am the girl who became Pirate Legend and gave away over 20K loot the following day...just to be nice...just to help out a friendly pirate.

    I am also the girl who the day after giving away all that loot was betrayed at a fort for the millionth time.

    So, yes, I'm less likely to be friendly now. I'm less likely to believe you if YOU say you're friendly. Because I've heard that before, and I've believed that before...and I've paid for that before.

    So, no... Pirate Legends are not jerks for refusing to hold your hand and dance to your shanty. Pirate Legends are people who have seen it ALL in this game, and who have been betrayed far more than befriended.

    Sure, there are some people who will attack and grief just because they have that sparkly title and they feel it means they're somehow superior. Those people can suck it lol

    But most Pirate Legends are like me...we have been betrayed so many times that it's difficult to trust anyone...so it's nothing personal... we just won't put ourselves in a position to be betrayed any longer. It has happened one, five, seven, or nineteen thousand times.

    That is my feeling, and the feeling of every Pirate Legend I know and sail with. It's not personal. We've just lived....we've sailed... we've learned.

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  • InboundBomb
    Commander
    Insider

    @mortarchelle I support this claim. We pirate legends are still few in numbers but our stormy eyes and stone cold gaze tells our story well. Not all of us are bad, just like you said.

  • Crowcomics
    Captain
    Insider
    Founder

    @mortarchelle
    I’ve only come across a handful of pirate legends and those I have come across have been extremely helpful. Sure a couple have sunk my ship for whatever reason. But the others have helped. One even gave me an Athena quest. Being mainly a solo player I was surprised by that. I’ve been playing since the Alpha. I trust few as in the end players just get bored and decide killing everything and anything on a server is more fun. Happened in the Division inside the Dark Zone. You’d be doing your thing then a team would slaughter you and just camp to kill you over and over. It’s a shame as this type of behaviour drives away the player base and before they know it there’s no one left to go out and kill. Hopefully some of the problems will be solved with the new AI ships. But the pesermist in me thinks it will come down to players turning on players as they’ve stated you can still sink a ship that’s in your alliance. So whichever crew gains the chest off the skeleton ship will probably be sunk as some players won’t “understand” every shares the rewards.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @crowcomics Let me just say this one thing... if I agree to be a friend, I will stay a friend until you betray me. I will NEVER pretend to be a friend and then betray. I think that kind of behavior is abhorrent. I don't judge anyone who does that because hey, the best thing about this game is being able to play it your own way....but that's just not me. I don't have it in my heart to gain someone's trust and then betray it... even in a video game. I was also extremely helpful for a while after hitting PL, but it backfired on me so many times. I have joined other crews and given them voyages, I have given away all the loot I had on my boat to someone else several times...I have helped other people find their chests on islands, I have fought skellies from OOS missions and brought the skulls to the enemy ships...and I have been betrayed by the ships I attempted to help more often than not....and that makes me less willing to help others.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @ant-heuser-kush said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @mortarchelle It doesn't take a PL to be betrayed.

    Other than that, I get your message.

    You are absolutely right. My point was that it takes so many hours to hit PL that by the time a person makes it there, they have been betrayed more often than the casual player :)

  • Crowcomics
    Captain
    Insider
    Founder

    I totally agree with all you’ve said. When I’m sailing and I come across another ship the last thing I do is get close enough to be ganked. Even if the other crew are dancing and waving. I have been chased across the map by sloops and galleons even though I’ve got no loot. Last thing I’m thinking about is let’s be friends. Come over let’s do a shanty together. lol I’ve scuttled more ships than I care to count. And like you what drew me to this game was the choose your own adventure. Play how you want do things your own way. Not a game on rails. And I’ve had some memorable voyages with some great people. Unfortunately human nature is what it is. During the Alpha there were no sloops we had to sail with others and I questioned whether to get the game. Players sailing off without you. Throwing loot overboard because it was funny to them. Exploding barrels and laughing as they logged off. And these players were meant to be on your side as you all form a crew. I’m still part of the Pioneers and most times in there it’s just a mess of ships sinking ships. But at least crews are working like a crew. So Ive had some fun considering it’s only on these rare occasions I’ll sail with randoms. Just makes me wonder why Rare doesn’t resurrect the Sea of Damned” from the concept art. I’ve talked in great length with friends how a PvP arena would work and give players a way to grind out PvP cosmetics. Be the pirate king or lord or whatever they tell their friends after sinking a parked sloop with the player off looking for treasure or chickens. Add in a leader board and have it separated from the Thieves. And no don’t make the main game PvE only. Keep that as is. Just cut the map into 4 regions. Each week rotate the region you play in. Throw some crews at it. Let them blow each other up. Get gold, get rep, get cosmetics. But more importantly let’s see how some of these players feel when facing off against Captains and crews who aren’t preoccupied doing other things. (Ok end my rant)

  • D Jaguar
    Captain
    Insider

    Still fun to see purple sails and try to sink them. 😁

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @d-jaguar Come get me then ;)

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @crowcomics I completely agree with you. I'm wondering if Foresaken Shores will be a PVP area?

  • VEPARIGA

    My first encounter with a PL was a crew of PL in a Galleon that i watched sail around and sink my anchored Sloop then chase me around the island, i had to drop my pig and eventually they got me.

  • Captain Fob4141
    Commander
    Insider

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    ....I frequently hear this. "Pirate Legends are jerks" or some variation of the last word. OK. I understand the logic. PLs are people who don't need the loot for rep, and yet they fight for it anyway. As a PL, let me offer an alternative theory.

    It is approximated that it takes around 250 hours of gameplay to reach Pirate Legend. In that 250 hours, a pirate will have been betrayed any number of times, and eventually they get to the point where enough is enough.

    I was always the friendly pirate...the "let's be friends and sail together" pirate. I was rarely betrayed. As the percentage of betrayal began to exceed the percentage of friendship though, I began to become more mistrusting... more cautious... and less willing to help "friendly" crews.

    I am the girl who became Pirate Legend and gave away over 20K loot the following day...just to be nice...just to help out a friendly pirate.

    I am also the girl who the day after giving away all that loot was betrayed at a fort for the millionth time.

    So, yes, I'm less likely to be friendly now. I'm less likely to believe you if YOU say you're friendly. Because I've heard that before, and I've believed that before...and I've paid for that before.

    So, no... Pirate Legends are not jerks for refusing to hold your hand and dance to your shanty. Pirate Legends are people who have seen it ALL in this game, and who have been betrayed far more than befriended.

    Sure, there are some people who will attack and grief just because they have that sparkly title and they feel it means they're somehow superior. Those people can suck it lol

    But most Pirate Legends are like me...we have been betrayed so many times that it's difficult to trust anyone...so it's nothing personal... we just won't put ourselves in a position to be betrayed any longer. It has happened one, five, seven, or nineteen thousand times.

    That is my feeling, and the feeling of every Pirate Legend I know and sail with. It's not personal. We've just lived....we've sailed... we've learned.

    The flaw with this logic is that PL are the only player uneffected by betrayals (excluding those involving Athena's chests)

  • SupriseAutopsy
    Ship Mate

    Far as I'm concerned, PLs are about the same as other players. There's the same chances of them attacking, ignoring, or saying hello as any other level player. However there is that little extra layer of salt when a ship with legend sails and paint starts chasing you. Like really? Do you really need the two skulls and seafarer chest I have on board? Just that little extra sting knowing it doesn't even benefit the legend chasing you.

  • Hynieth
    Master
    Insider

    I think this stems more from PL's in open crews then from PL's themselves. Most PL I've seen (as someone who doesn't use open crew) are ones just AFK'ing on the ferry.

    I've also heard some stories about PL's just being really jerky in crews they join trying to boss people around and them being full of themselves. Even accounts of PL's dropping treasure off the ship.

    I don't wear my PL clothing or the title. I just drop an Athena for my crew from time to time but I'm no different from the others.

  • Gontrop
    Captain
    Insider

    @MortarChelle I relate to that too, how many times I lost my animals soloing for a MA voyage, because there were sloops or Galleons on the outpost I needed to deliver? Even using the chat to ask ppl mercy because I only had animals to deliver!
    Or when they saw me nearby and left people camping the outpost just to kill my animals.
    I even did the last solos for the last part of the rep in MA with one or two gunpowder barrels over the animals... "you sink me, you don't get my animals! BOOM"

    Although, i'm always friendly, until provoked!

  • MarsMayflower
    Captain
    Insider

    just hit PL. I'll probably strut around for a week or two but I'm definitely a friendly pirate.

  • Dwight1833
    Marauder

    It is true

    I am a Pirate Legend, as is my brother. We started the game being friendly with others who were friendly to us. But time after time someone appears to be friendly, claims to be friendly only to get close enough to attack and betray us.

    So anymore if someone approaches saying they are friendly, it is all hands on cannons. depending on how they approach, we may fire first.

    We have been attacked that way far too many times

  • Crimsonraziel
    Master
    Insider

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    But most Pirate Legends are like me...

    There was a specific term for that fallacy

  • BaHaMuTxZeR0
    Marauder

    There is definitely good PL out there, the action of a few should not reflect on all PL. I do however have an example of some toxic PL i ran across the other day.

    While my galleon crew was at Crooked masts finishing up an Oos another galleon pulled up since they were also doing one. We were friendly and helped him out and killed the captain. PL joined his galleon and took all of his treasure and put it on our ship and used our cannons until he sank his own crews ship. So we immediately killed him and they managed to brig the PL.

    So we hauled the guys loot back aboard our ship to wait for his galleon to arrive to load it back up. Another PL joined his crew, at first he wasn't doing anything wrong and we told him that they have treasure on our ship they can take. A random on that crew started blasting our ship so it put my crew in high alert and started swinging on the PL boarding our ship. I can hear the guy telling his crew mate to cease fire and i diffuse the situation on my ship between the PL and my crew mate. Then he just had to start trash talking which i just am not going to deal with on my boat so he was killed and we sailed away with the rest of their treasure.

    Now I don't assume every PL is this way but I do think the lack of activities for PL contributes to some of these players acting like that.

  • W4r34gl3 4 L1f3

    @MortarChelle
    I absolutely agree with what you have said. As I played and grided my way to PL I was not a hostile player. Then the time came when enough was enough. Most PL do not think they are better players than everyone. Nor do we think we own the seas. We as PL do try to take pride in our accomplishment of getting there. As stated above in a reply post most players do see purple sails and come after them. They want to see if they can take out the mighty PL. Why is this? Is it because they have the false pretenses that all PL think they are better than the rest. Well for those that do you couldn’t be more wrong. We (well most of us I can’t speak for all) don’t all fell that way. Most of us are just trying to grind out the last of part of this game.
    The other day while waiting for the door to open on the farry I ran into a lady. She asked if we could be friends I said sure. I then told her to go to two different islands and pick up 4 hateful skulls and some marauders chest. She told her crew and they asked why. I told her we where speed running Athena and leaving treasure behind. Unless we have lower level players on our crew this is what we do. Not because my crew and myself think we are to good for the treasure, but to help anyone on the server that finds it gain more than we would or will.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @rattlyfob I see your point but PLs are still affected. You're still losing something that you worked for. Maybe you don't lose anything more than gold, and a bit of pride smirk but it still sucks to help someone only to be stabbed in the back for it.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @crimsonraziel said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    But most Pirate Legends are like me...

    There was a specific term for that fallacy

    Good point. I should have said "Most Pirate Legends that I play with" as I surely can't speak for all of them as a whole.

  • Captain Fob4141
    Commander
    Insider

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @rattlyfob I see your point but PLs are still affected. You're still losing something that you worked for. Maybe you don't lose anything more than gold, and a bit of pride smirk but it still sucks to help someone only to be stabbed in the back for it.

    There is more pride in having the skill and power to offer a team and repell the anticipated betrayal. Ie if you can team with everyone and kill them when they betray you without having to make the first move you are far stronger and more legendary than the one who fears all and kills all in response

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @BaHaMuTxZeR0 Yeah, that's a reason I don't ever play with randoms anymore. Too many people join just to troll. I'd honestly rather play alone. It sucks though because I have met so many amazing people by playing with randoms. In fact, all the people I play with now, save 1 or 2, were all randoms at one time that joined me. The thing is, what those PLs did to you...a LOT of people do things like that, but when a PL does it, "they're a jerk, they're toxic, etc."

    As for me, I do not generally attack first, unless at a skull fort. If another ship approaches me, I do not shoot on sight, I wait for them to make the first move. I'll still help people and give loot away, I'm just less trustworthy now.

    The other night I was on a solo sloop just messing around with some GH missions and another solo sloop pulled up. I kept an eye on him while I dug up the 5 chests I had on the island. Then while he was preoccupied finding a chicken, I noticed he had left his sail slightly down and his ship was grinding on a rock. I boarded his ship, raised his sail, repaired the one hole in the back and bailed his water. Then I loaded the 5 chests I just dug up onto his boat, by the steering wheel. I never said anything to him, just fixed his ship, gave him my chests, and sailed away. So I am still friendly when I feel it's safe to be...but I don't feel it's safe to be as often as I used to.

    @MarsMayflower Congrats on hitting PL!

    @W4r34gl3-4-L1f3 Nice, dude! I'm exactly the same.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @rattlyfob But that's exactly what I do. I don't fear all and kill all. I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying. My words were these:

    "So, yes, I'm less likely to be friendly now. I'm less likely to believe you if YOU say you're friendly. Because I've heard that before, and I've believed that before...and I've paid for that before."

    I always wait for the other team to make the first move...but when people approach me and say "we're friendly, wanna do X together?" I'm no longer just saying "yeah, sure!" I'm way more cautious, and if I feel that the crew is the betraying kind, I politely decline and sail away, sometimes giving them some loot before I go. I never said I sink them if I don't trust them. However, more than half the time when I politely decline, they attack...which leads me to believe that my assessment was correct not to befriend them.

  • Captain Fob4141
    Commander
    Insider

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @rattlyfob But that's exactly what I do. I don't fear all and kill all. I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying. My words were these:

    "So, yes, I'm less likely to be friendly now. I'm less likely to believe you if YOU say you're friendly. Because I've heard that before, and I've believed that before...and I've paid for that before."

    I always wait for the other team to make the first move...but when people approach me and say "we're friendly, wanna do X together?" I'm no longer just saying "yeah, sure!" I'm way more cautious, and if I feel that the crew is the betraying kind, I politely decline and sail away, sometimes giving them some loot before I go. I never said I sink them if I don't trust them. However, more than half the time when I politely decline, they attack...which leads me to believe that my assessment was correct not to befriend them.

    Im not refering to you specifically... im talking about the vast majority of pirate legends you are trying to defend.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @rattlyfob It's not a defense, it's an explanation. There is no defense needed. It's an open sandbox pirate game and the beauty of the game is that people can play it however they want. It doesn't make the bloodthirsty pirates, legends or not, "bad" or "wrong" or "jerks" because they have a different playstyle than you.

    And honestly, unless you know you've played with the vast majority of Pirate Legends, I don't think you can say that the vast majority play that way.

  • Jacknife Wilson
    Marauder
    Insider

    In my view, commonality of historical betrays against me aside. I've got to admit I act however I do mostly out of a desire to entertain myself. Since I usually find enjoyment in working with others who need it; or committing to silliness like chest giveaways, spreading the faith of the golden feathers ones, filming videos for contests, whatever.... Betrayal isn't usually something I commit too. Combat sure, Pvp no problem, but betrayal no - perhaps once or thrice at most honestly.

    I think I can count the number of times I have straight out back-stabbed other pirates on one hand. Sure, I have attacked more than I can account for with little to no motivation beyond things like : "they were there", "they are in my way", "I'm bored", or what have you. That's what happens when your bored or simply have alternate interests from another player in a open world styled game.

    But I don't speak to defend myself so much as to suggest; I don't feel most PL are inspired by simple nastiness. Sure, there are alot of negative encounters with PL's in the world we play in. It's just a numbers game in that regard. Frankly, I feel most PL are just players looking for a good time, and many players don't tend to comprehend that this is not a scripted game. It's a "who knows wtheck is going to happen!?" open world sandboxy environment. What does that mean? You can't predict what any given encounter might yield. What can be expected is that players are looking to have fun and if that means killing and taking loot?

    So be it, eh?

  • Dragonsire2016
    Seafarer

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @BaHaMuTxZeR0 Yeah, that's a reason I don't ever play with randoms anymore. Too many people join just to troll. I'd honestly rather play alone. It sucks though because I have met so many amazing people by playing with randoms. In fact, all the people I play with now, save 1 or 2, were all randoms at one time that joined me. The thing is, what those PLs did to you...a LOT of people do things like that, but when a PL does it, "they're a jerk, they're toxic, etc."

    As for me, I do not generally attack first, unless at a skull fort. If another ship approaches me, I do not shoot on sight, I wait for them to make the first move. I'll still help people and give loot away, I'm just less trustworthy now.

    The other night I was on a solo sloop just messing around with some GH missions and another solo sloop pulled up. I kept an eye on him while I dug up the 5 chests I had on the island. Then while he was preoccupied finding a chicken, I noticed he had left his sail slightly down and his ship was grinding on a rock. I boarded his ship, raised his sail, repaired the one hole in the back and bailed his water. Then I loaded the 5 chests I just dug up onto his boat, by the steering wheel. I never said anything to him, just fixed his ship, gave him my chests, and sailed away. So I am still friendly when I feel it's safe to be...but I don't feel it's safe to be as often as I used to.

    @MarsMayflower Congrats on hitting PL!

    @W4r34gl3-4-L1f3 Nice, dude! I'm exactly the same.

    wow...nice.

  • Captain Fob4141
    Commander
    Insider

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @rattlyfob It's not a defense, it's an explanation. There is no defense needed. It's an open sandbox pirate game and the beauty of the game is that people can play it however they want. It doesn't make the bloodthirsty pirates, legends or not, "bad" or "wrong" or "jerks" because they have a different playstyle than you.

    And honestly, unless you know you've played with the vast majority of Pirate Legends, I don't think you can say that the vast majority play that way.

    Considering pirate legends consitute about 0.1% of 4.5 million players there are only around 5000 pirate legends (rounded up). A random sampling of 100 or so encounters would represent 2% and would be a good example of the overall demographic. Of the (about) 100 pirate legends I have seen/met only like 10~15 where reasonable (even those on my crew... most of which were negative experiences). So I can say that yeah, most interactions with pirate legends are negative.

    BTW bloodthirsty DNE good/bad. Reasonableness and toxicity does.

  • MarsMayflower
    Captain
    Insider

    @mortarchelle hey, thanks!

  • SpringOtter
    Master

    You're literally just saying "I'm not a jerk! I was a saint that encountered so many other jerks that they have now turned me into a jerk, but because I tried I'm not a jerk.

  • BaHaMuTxZeR0
    Marauder

    @mortarchelle For sure, I think we are saying the same thing although I seem to cast shade in my example of the recent PL i crossed haha... I'm sure we both have stories of regular pirates doing the same if not worse things. I always treat everyone with caution no matter what they are saying. My eyes are always on my boat and treasure.
    I still have to come back to the same problem I think many people have pointed out. Once you are a PL and Athena lvl 10 what else is there to do for PL? They are just going to do what they want and now they don't have any consequences since they don't really need to do work to get money/rep. Sure there will be a bunch of PL who just help people and enjoy the game but there is always 2 sides where the others are just going to log on to PVP until their hearts content.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @blackelite-id16 Incorrect. I still don't kill people for no reason. I wait to see what they do first. If other ships let me be, then I let them be (except at a fort).

    All I said was that I'm LESS likely to just friendship up with people than I used to be, but if I decline to sail together, it does not mean I shoot, sink, grief them, or steal their loot. I just say no and move on my way. If they shoot us in the back as we sail away, THEN we will sink them.

    And I never said I was a saint. I said I was friendly...meaning I was always willing to work with anyone. Now I'm much more leery about who I "friendship" up with. That makes me a jerk?

    No, I'm not a jerk. Neither are the people who DO sink people on sight. It's part of the game, and if that's how they want to play it, that's fine.

  • MortarChelle
    Master
    Insider

    @rattlyfob said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @mortarchelle said in "Pirate Legends are all jerks!":

    @rattlyfob It's not a defense, it's an explanation. There is no defense needed. It's an open sandbox pirate game and the beauty of the game is that people can play it however they want. It doesn't make the bloodthirsty pirates, legends or not, "bad" or "wrong" or "jerks" because they have a different playstyle than you.

    And honestly, unless you know you've played with the vast majority of Pirate Legends, I don't think you can say that the vast majority play that way.

    Considering pirate legends consitute about 0.1% of 4.5 million players there are only around 5000 pirate legends (rounded up). A random sampling of 100 or so encounters would represent 2% and would be a good example of the overall demographic. Of the (about) 100 pirate legends I have seen/met only like 10~15 where reasonable (even those on my crew... most of which were negative experiences). So I can say that yeah, most interactions with pirate legends are negative.

    BTW bloodthirsty DNE good/bad. Reasonableness and toxicity does.

    All valid points.

  • SubjectCandy
    Marauder
    Insider
    Founder

    I'm also a PL and I play with just PLs usually. If I join your crew, I'll be the friendliest pirate, but if I'm not I will aim to sink you. Why? Because I enjoy PvP. It's fun killing people. You can keep your loot, I love the challenge of defeating other players.

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