Fixing the Player Schism, aka An End to Saltyness

@urihamrayne The idea is to be paired with like-minded players. If your style is to sometimes kill, and sometimes not, then you would end up on a server full of people who also sometimes kill, sometimes not. The game has enough players for there to be plenty of gray areas. Point is, your own style determines the frequency of hostile encounters.

I support any idea such as this... for the first time ever in this game I have honestly found myself wishing there was a PvE server. Now I know that won't ever happen which is fine but trying to complete this anniversary quest has made me feel like this... it is so difficult when you are trying to get immersed in this awesome quest, learning more about the order of souls, solving the trap puzzle etc etc, spending quite a bit of time, bringing your skeleton chest containing quest objectives back to plunder outpost and campers kill you in 2 minutes. All of that hard work gone in 2 minutes.

I don't mind this happening once though, it's just one of those things. But I've noticed A LOT of PvPers seem to be camping plunder outpost at the moment as they know it's a hot spot with this quest... something needs to be done...

@lem0n-curry How would a high score player be placed with lower score players anyway?... Unless you mean a lower score player who suddenly wants to play like a high score player. Which is fine, they are free to do that, but their score will change according to their action. The system would still be an improvement on what we have currently.

@lem0n-curry With such a wide range of scores, it's really more about consistency. 1-10 kills in self-defense wouldn't affect your pairing at all.

I would imagine if you form a crew with your friends, and one of your friends has a high kill rating, the crew's average score could be used. It's not like one hostile crew member will automatically make the whole crew hostile.

High-low may have been too simple a description. Essentially when logging in you would be placed within a range of your kill score. There would be no designated "low" or "high" servers. Just a check to look at your score and go "this pirate has a kill rating of 80. He will be placed on a server with other pirates who score as close to 80 as possible while maintaining a stable population." Kill rating could also decrement over time, so that you're not stuck on pvp-inclined servers if your style changes.

There is fine-tuning that will have to be done with the help of playtesters.

@foxdodge said in Fixing the Player Schism, aka An End to Saltyness:

@xix-zeno-xix Would the application of the process notably impact matchmaking?

Absolutely. In random matchmaking you would be paired by the same process, so your crew would be made up of pirates in your kill-range. If you specifically decide to group with friends and their rating differs from yours, I imagine using the crew average score would be best, as using solely the host's rating would provide an exploitable workaround.

@guepard4 The idea is meant to work specifically in adventure mode and would make no sense in Arena, where everyone is hostile and should be.

In adventure mode, adding just a few lines of code to the server placement algorithm would greatly reduce the likelihood of running into players you don't want to play with. I don't see why you think it would force "good" players to be paired with aggressive ones.

@the-minion-256 said in Fixing the Player Schism, aka An End to Saltyness:

I was unable to unearth an email with which to contact devs. I hope this finds the right people:

Dear Devs,

I am a Gamedev from Germany. Mostly indie stuff, so I don't presume to be in a position to give Rare of all people advice. I mean, I grew up on games like Conker's Bad Fur Day, Perfect Dark, Banjo-Kazooie, and Donkey Kong Country. You guys are legends! But I have been kicking around an idea and have been running it past other players to a lot of positive feedback.

I am an avid Sea of Thieves player. As Devs in touch with your community, you are aware of the schism. The PVE players interested in forming alliances and immersing themselves in the quest and story content of the game are "salty" about the more PVP-inclined players. Clearly, you are aware of this problem, as you have been considering allowing XBOX players to opt out of cross-play with PC players, as most of the more hostile players tend to be a part of the PC community. Separating the two communities might help towards resolving the issue, but may also isolate the more peace-seeking PC players, dooming them to a sea of trolls, while the more PVP-loving XBOX players will find no one to pick a decent fight with. Adding the arena was a brilliant stroke. I'm happy to report that since its implementation, my own game experience has improved significantly.

I propose an elegant solution that should allow both types of players to get the most out of their in-game experience.

You have an algorithm that places players onto servers and shuffles those players around as servers get too full or empty. Why not give each pirate a hidden variable that increments every time they kill another player or sink a player ship, then tell your algorithm to place players with high kill aggression values onto servers with other high-aggression players, and likewise for players with low scores? Players would then be increasingly likely to encounter like-minded players. Peace-loving pirates would meet more pirates to form alliances with or give a friendly wave to when they run into each other at outposts. Aggressive pirates are more likely to run into others with the same style, offering more chance at epic battles on the high seas. Players who would rather play "Sea of Friends" can, and the part of a community that finds that style ridiculous are now able to play together. The more you kill other players, the more you will run into other players who want to kill you. The more you let other players live, the more pirates you will meet that have no interest in killing you. Everybody wins.

I love your game, and immensely enjoy experiencing it as it grows and improves. I do hope you will consider my idea and look forward to watching Sea of Thieves develop.

Sincerely,
"M!nion"
Dev

I will have to disagree with this idea completely. You are going a roundabout way to create PvE Servers and are segregating the player base.

Your idea is just bad. Given enough time the servers would end up being completely segregated with PvP over on this side of the algorithm and PvE on this side of the algorithm.

You want to help with the games development? Then offer ideas that help the growth of the entire game. Instead of trying to focus on the PvE sides crying and whining, how about just suggesting more ideas that keep both player bases together??

I seriously doubt you are an actual developer with you suggesting an idea like this. Like what criteria are you using to label yourself a developer? I am a developer from America (I develop sandwiches when I'm hungry). Trying to completely make one side happy while messing with the other is not a sign of good judgement for a developer.

The game has a vision and its sticking to that vision. The growth of the game can go through leaps and bounds by just sticking to their belief. The second we start trying to separate the player base and trying to make everyone happy, or suggesting biased ideas to help one side while screwing over the other side, you are going to slow development down to a crawl and kill the game of any loyal fan base.

The whole allure of the game is that you don't know whats going to happen when you join the game. Thats why players need to stop trying to separate the player base.

Watch the horizon, learn how to fight back and defend yourself, stop the whining and crying, realize you are playing a particular type of game and it has PvP in it, and especially figure out that sea of thieves is not suppose to be Sea of Friends.

@foxdodge Thank you. The hope behind this idea was not splitting the player base completely. That would be no different than creating a PVE server. It's a game about pirates. It should come as no surprise that you have to watch your back to an extent. My solution would simply reduce or increase the likelihood of pvp encounters depending on your style. Without condoning or condemning any specific style of play, you just have to look around to see that a significant number of players are frustrated and unhappy, and the other side of the schism is just as unhappy about the situation.

Let's say you never act aggressively at all, giving you a kill rating of 0. The algorithm would pair you with players as close to 0 as possible, depending on who is available. If only rating 50 players are on (unlikely, but for the sake of argument), then thats who you share a server with. Most likely the population might range from kill ratings 10 to 30, for example. And you can never rule out new players who cant wait to sink the first ship they see. This implementation would not create a strict PVE environment for anyone, but it would help to seperate the 2 extreme poles of players who seem to harbor so much hostility towards each other, thus creating a more enjoyable experience for everyone involved.

Those who's style of play involves trolling and abuse of lesser-experienced pirates will understandably hate my idea, as it would drain their victim pool. But I think even the pvp crowd that isnt interested in only punching down would benefit.

@lem0n-curry Why would a PvE player be inviting a PvP orientated player? They would have contrasting goals... both players could have individual scores which are added anyway.

I don't know who is really sad enough to create a new pirate every day lol, these people are literally not gunna be able to keep any of the gold/treasure they win if they keep making new characters... although if people really wanted to do that, how about everyone starts at a low score, low score = you are put into more PvP orientated servers... your score increases BY NOT engaging in PvP fights, thus PvE orientated players would have a higher score and PvPers who remake a new character would have an automatically low score, or perhaps some other 'default' value, there would be ways round this for sure.

Players who don't want PvP at all should probably play a different game.. that isn't what this suggestion is hoping to achieve...

The only downside to this is if you are good at defending yourself.

Should you successfully rebuff pirate attacks you will eventually be merged into a most hostile server.

And be forced to do even more of it.

Then you will get those players who will then cheat the system and get themselves killed quickly to join a more passive server in order to take advantage of a more PVE based audience.