Please read the entire post before forming a final opinion and replying. Does anyone else think Rare should increase the amount of allegiance for losing? From what I can tell, it would take over 1000 sinks just to get to level 100, which is kind of ridiculous. With the inconsistent matchmaking time, ineffective SBMM (which is most likely a factor in the inconsistent matchmaking time), and the fact that you can be in a fight for an hour, lose, and still only get a tiny bit makes this grind seem impossible for traditionally pve players. I know its a pvp update, but i dont know how to improve as this mode doesnt seem very good for practice so far, or at least not in my experience. Considering people have been wanting this curse for forever, it kind of sucks that it requires such a high pvp skill level. Before someone replies that im one of those people who wants pve servers or someone who thinks that souls games should have an easy mode for example, know that im not. I can understand the whole "get good" attitude, but because of these reasons above, such as not providing good practice, I think the allegiance for losing needs to be increased as I dont understand how people who dont usually engage in pvp often (especially those like myself who have wanted a ghost curse since they started playing the game) are supposed to even be able to compete and be able to get to 100. If getting to 100 seems this impossible for those who dont pvp often, how is level 1000 even a thought crossing our mind. I dont want to give up, as I want this curse more than anything in the game (just the base standard blue ghostly level 100 one), but its really hard to keep going at it knowing that all your effort for each match is rewarded with so little if you lose. I know getting some allegiance is better than nothing, but I cant see a lot of traditionally pve players being able to grind this before people simply arent playing it anymore. It certainly doesnt seem as popular for others as I would have expected. I dont think its good that this curse is basically locked from traditionally non pvpers since so many players (especially pve-ers I would assume) have wanted this curse for so long. Im not at all saying that there should be a pve alternative unlock for it, I still think it should require pvp, I just think the progression should be made faster for those who dont usually engage in pvp. Its not simply a legendary sea dog weapon skin (im not saying theyre bad), its a long-awaited by so many, amazing-looking curse! I cant get my friends on board with this grind because of how crazily slow it is, and I rarely connect or have fun with random people in looking for groups (especially since the majority of them say be good at pvp, which discourages me from applying in the first place). I think Im good enough at hand to hand combat, but I really struggle with naval, and I just cant seem to get better. So far Im only at level 18 Guardians of Fortune, and already it feels torturous and impossible to reach 100. Another, and possibly better, fix would to just make each level in the new two factions specifically require the same amount of allegiance for each level. This would make it so that every sink you get a level, and around every 4-5 sinks yourself to make a level as well. This would make people able to streak probably level up too fast (naturally, good pvpers should get it first before not-so-good pvpers such as myself, but where it stands right now, progression for not-so-good pvpers is way too slow and draining), but I feel like this system would be much better, especially for those who havent done pvp often, or never played arena, etc. Im also debating on whether SBMM should just be removed in general. Yes, traditionally non pvpers would run into players with a much higher skill level more often, but I believe it would make matchmaking for everybody much faster and more consistent, which I feel outweighs the previously mentioned negative effect. Does anyone else agree with any of this? Does anyone else think Rare should do this since the new curses have been sought after by so many people (including non pvpers)? I really hope they do something to make it significantly easier for people like me.
Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?
I personally believe SOMETHING needs to be done about this update. I’m someone who actively looks for PVP, and I would consider myself not a god, but quite good at PVP in this game. With the SBMM (some say it’s still sorting out and some say it’s done already) matches on week one are already slowing down. I think that there should be a higher allegiance increase for however long a match is. That way if I’m in an hour long match (which usually means it’s a good fight or my opponent is running and wasting time) then I’m rewarded for my time and dedication to the fight. Week one I’m already experiencing long queues (10-20 minutes to find one match) only for that match to last anywhere from 5 minutes to 1.5 hours. Both of which net me the same amount of allegiance win or lose. The allegiance is great where it’s at, if all matches were a less than or equal to 5 minute queue time, with the match being around 10-15 minutes (like almost all PVP FPS games) but the fact that matches can take so long and queue times are already bad, it makes an already long grind a slog. Getting to the point that I will purposefully lose 5 or so matches in a row just to be dropped to a lower bracket where more people are playing. I don’t think that’s the grind Rare has in mind, but if I have to dunk on a couple newbies just to get both of my curses in a decent amount of time, then I’m sorry guys.
I'm not sure I entirely agree with the idea but it would be nice. For me I keep getting matchmaked with people well over my skill level and I keep sinking because of my skill. I felt like this mode would help me improve but it really hasn't at all especially when I get absolutely get destroyed by the enemy. The sbmm seems to work sometimes but for me I feel like I'll never get the curse at this rate.
They should give us more alliance levels for dying but it should end at level 100.
Most people want the basic curses. Not everyone is a PvP sweat lord. Personally, I don’t feel we get enough alliances levels now. It should be a one for one victory.
Consider this, it took 240 wins as a pirates legend to unlock PL weapons in the arena. Now it takes 1000 levels to get the cool new curses? Yes the curses are cooler and should be locked behind more wins but not if a single win only get you a 1/4 of a level! Level 0 I got 2 levels for a win and it’s getting harder now my level is increasing. A single win no longer get me a single level.
Lets keep in mind they wanted to make sure you can't "cheese" your way to victory by scuttling or going out of bounds you make 0 progress doing either method. This leads to people painstakingly just letting the opponent get in a few hits and never repairing or burning your own ship down every match. The sad truth is despite winning being a faster path to lvl 100, without a timer to limit match length you could rack up more losses in the time it would take you to get 1 win. That is a gamble though as you could get a quick win as well.
Lets also keep in mind the lvl cap is what 1000? I don't think its that unfair to ask for the ability to buy levels for this system. They did it with arena and that was only 50 levels and didn't have a purchase restriction back then. 83 years to buy your way to level cap is insane I don't think PvPers should cry about us being able to buy 1 level a month even if our only goal is lvl 100 thats still 8 years. Less if we actually fight but lets say we do it 50 playing and 50 purchases thats still 4 years worth of buying levels to get a curse that streamers have unlocked in a week....
In case it wasn't obvious I don't think I mentioned yea losses should be a bit more xp than they are. They already try to prevent people from throwing matches by sailing out of bounds or scuttling for faster progression but even now a win can take so long that losing quicker is faster for some people. That being said the grind is long enough that most people will just abandon the system altogether. Similar to arena the majority of the people who will hit lvl 100 will be the unemployed or those who game for a living (streamers) while the majority of players, especially the casuals will suffer with a long impossible grind. Even if we could buy levels which they probably will never allow 80+ years to hit level cap... Who would vote against letting us buy a lvl a month lol.
All the arena players and pvp kids upset with the new season because it’s a grind.
From what I can tell, it would take over 1000 sinks just to get to level 100, which is kind of ridiculous.
So your losing a lot and want to be rewarded more with losing so you can quickly still access the new rewards?
Players. Please. Think about it. The new curses and access to the hideouts underground are suppose to be grand and earned. So what you have to sink 1000+ ships. Not even a month yet!! Not even a month….
Take your time…enjoy….
As someone who will likely never get streaks or champion or sink a champion I'm happy we get loser points. I might be tempted to get wrecked a little more often if I got a little more for say, bringing a flag with me. Or I even get some sort of acknowledgement for defending and no one attacks me.
(Haven't defended yet, not patient enough or something)
Anyway, if you see me pop up go ahead and sink me lol. I don't want to ask for any changes for a while so MM can sort, and Rare can see how the numbers are stacking up.
Although partners should have their progress cut in half...
I can’t speak for others, but for me I don’t want it to be an insane grind, not to make the rewards not exclusive (I think they should) but more of thinking that the game mode might not stay alive long enough for a good grind. Arena didn’t die for a while after it released, but it was also received a lot better than this update was (granted there was the change from multiple to 1 chest but still) LSD was a long grind yes, but matches were a lot faster in most cases, and easier to access. That’s why I think there should be a raise to allegiance.
Another thing I consider is that the “long grind” should be for both factions. If you’re a hardcore fan you might want both curses. Leveling up both factions should be a long grind, not a slog. Sinking around 300 ships (streak depending/ around 150 per faction) just for the BASE curses should not be the “short” part of the grind. Or maybe it should, but if 1 sink is around an hour long with more for stocking/ matchmaking, then it’s a slog.
(Note: I know I added more onto this part than the @ was referencing but I didn’t want to make a whole new post)Some people forget all too easy the 1 hour spent back in the day to just get one glowly chest for 1/16th of an Athena level... There are crews hitting level 25 easy with just 15-20 sinks. 1k sinks to level 100? Think your math is off there. Try running streaks to 5-10 and turning in those grade 5 flags when you get them with a grade 5 raised yourself.
@alphawolf7878 I hear you, and understand completely. Right now lvl8 rep for guardians and have 3 (unintentional) wins with X losses. Hard to track because it's mostly every engagement. And it is ON PURPOSE! I too wondered how Rare would continue to incentivize players who lose more than win. You're right that 1000 losses might be the number to reach rep100. As stated, maybe around 40-50 losses and rep8, close to 9. However... it IS, in my humble opinion, demoralizing to think what would be required from the average player to reach 1000. Or maybe the devs did not intend for the "normy" player to achieve such heights and really reserved for the sweatlords. Don't know but has been interesting to mess with. I imagine the devs are well aware of what actual numbers are regarding concurrent players, players engaged with the new system, those that are not, etc. Goodluck to you and hey, at least if we match, it's free rep 😉
@magus104 You describe what I'm currently undertaking. Loss after loss for rep as quickly as possible. Better for my opponents, better for me, let's not waste time. I'm going to sink, so let's get er done and I'll be back to repeat as often as possible. Heck, sometimes I bring supply crate with me. Have received many a thanks from sailors on their path to PL.
I’m not the OP, but I believe they were meaning they were sinking/ losing 1k times, not winning. I know there’s another post on the forums that state each loss is 1/14 of a level, and that they claim it’s the same no matter the level.
@dabomb139 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
I’m not the OP, but I believe they were meaning they were sinking/ losing 1k times, not winning. I know there’s another post on the forums that state each loss is 1/14 of a level, and that they claim it’s the same no matter the level.
Well then that is perfectly acceptable since the wins give so much. You get rewarded more for winning as that is what is supposed to happen in a video game.
@rikjaxx hes referring to my post, the rep slows down per loss after about 10 as you rank up. I've hit level 55 tonight and called it early. A crew was messing with my queue times so I didn't want to deal with it anymore. The other teams though were perfect and I was getting quick queues while Guardians had an 8-10 minute queue.
If you see a ship anchor off the bat and say hay hows it going and you waste time trying to take supplies with 1 tiny hole then it just slows everything down more I've noticed.
Im not sure about everyone else. But i feel the grind towards 100 is like the new pirate legend. Its deliberately long and they want you to have mostly wins but its so when you finally get in the hideout you feel like you earned it.
Fortunetely you dont have to do it alone either. Find a crew and do it together.
I think if you want pvp focused rewards then you simply gotta pvp. Just like how when you are a pvp player but need to grind those tall tales for the gold curse, we just sucked it up and done it.
When we finally got it, it was earned and not cheesed. Thats my take on it.
If they make it easier i wont complain but i think i see why it is the way it is.@burnbacon said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
All the arena players and pvp kids upset with the new season because it’s a grind.
From what I can tell, it would take over 1000 sinks just to get to level 100, which is kind of ridiculous.
So your losing a lot and want to be rewarded more with losing so you can quickly still access the new rewards?
Players. Please. Think about it. The new curses and access to the hideouts underground are suppose to be grand and earned. So what you have to sink 1000+ ships. Not even a month yet!! Not even a month….
Take your time…enjoy….
Im not saying the grind should be quick and that people should be able to get in a month or anything. I just think that right now, if youre losing basically every time, the grind is way too slow.
You can put up your best fight and get nothing in return. The other issue is that, unfortunately, I havent hardly been enjoying myself at all in this new mode because every solo sloop fight is super boring, long, and drawn out. I hardly made any progress yesterday and couldnt even level up because it simply wouldnt put me in a match, and with a looking for group, we did an entire veil without being invaded. So I just did world events and a couple FOTD instead.@shadow20642 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
Im not sure about everyone else. But i feel the grind towards 100 is like the new pirate legend. Its deliberately long and they want you to have mostly wins but its so when you finally get in the hideout you feel like you earned it.
Fortunetely you dont have to do it alone either. Find a crew and do it together.
I think if you want pvp focused rewards then you simply gotta pvp. Just like how when you are a pvp player but need to grind those tall tales for the gold curse, we just sucked it up and done it.
When we finally got it, it was earned and not cheesed. Thats my take on it.
If they make it easier i wont complain but i think i see why it is the way it is.No offense, but I feel like a pvp player grinding gold curse and a pve player grinding Guardians of Fortune that can hardly get any wins is a bit of an unfair comparison.
Also, trust me, I dont want a pve alternative, im perfectly fine with doing pvp for this, I just think something needs to be done to make it easier, as it really seems impossible for me at least at the moment.
I want to keep going, but its hard as I dont feel like its helping me get any closer to ghost curse because you simply get so little allegiance.@mouse-n-keybord said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
The other teams though were perfect and I was getting quick queues while Guardians had an 8-10 minute queue.
I feel like the long matchmaking times are a significant effect slowing down this grind much longer than it needs to. Someone told me there was a bug specifically for Guardians of Fortune causing the long queue times, not sure if it was true or not though. He claimed Servants always have less than a min matchmaking where Guardians typically have 6+ min. Im guessing he was full of it but I havent actually researched it for myself.
@kommodoreyenser said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
@dabomb139 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
I’m not the OP, but I believe they were meaning they were sinking/ losing 1k times, not winning. I know there’s another post on the forums that state each loss is 1/14 of a level, and that they claim it’s the same no matter the level.
Well then that is perfectly acceptable since the wins give so much. You get rewarded more for winning as that is what is supposed to happen in a video game.
Getting more for winning makes perfect sense, I just think what you get for losing atm, especially in the later levels, is way too little.
@alphawolf7878 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
@kommodoreyenser said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
@dabomb139 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
I’m not the OP, but I believe they were meaning they were sinking/ losing 1k times, not winning. I know there’s another post on the forums that state each loss is 1/14 of a level, and that they claim it’s the same no matter the level.
Well then that is perfectly acceptable since the wins give so much. You get rewarded more for winning as that is what is supposed to happen in a video game.
Getting more for winning makes perfect sense, I just think what you get for losing atm, especially in the later levels, is way too little.
Once the MMR gets settled in, you will basically be winning as much as you lose. This system isn't gonna fill out in 48-72 hours. This will take weeks to months as the system filters players into their MMR zones and targets a 50% winrate for each tier. That's always how these work when launched. My best advice to you is to wait til month 2 if you don't want to lose as often. All the skilled crews will be higher up and then you will have an easier time.
@dabomb139 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
I’m not the OP, but I believe they were meaning they were sinking/ losing 1k times, not winning. I know there’s another post on the forums that state each loss is 1/14 of a level, and that they claim it’s the same no matter the level.
Correct, it would take well over 1000 losses, although considering how much it takes to level up by losing compared to winning at level 18, i think later levels it would take around 1/16, 1/17, or possibly even 1/18. Right now, at level 18, losses give around 1/9 - 1/10 of a level. This might not sound so bad, but I seem to be cursed with slow matchmaking, not exactly the curse im trying to get.
@goldsmen Sorry, I rarely use the forums and didnt think about it, plan on breaking it into paragraphs for next time
Tips for those who wish to try: You can pre-fill your boat with water that carries to the match, simply running into the island or outpost your spawned at. Or sit for a min as a storm fills water in.
I have spawned in, turned out to a rock or explosive barrel to end things very quickly with usually 1 shot fired, if that. Most people catch on quick. Only 1 attempted to sail me out of bounds but "commandeering" his ship took him back to his vessel with the quickness and couldn't stop me from sinking myself on a rock. He even took all my firebombs 😅 left everything else. Rep10.5ish
@shadow20642 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
Im not sure about everyone else. But i feel the grind towards 100 is like the new pirate legend. Its deliberately long and they want you to have mostly wins but its so when you finally get in the hideout you feel like you earned it.
Fortunetely you dont have to do it alone either. Find a crew and do it together.
I think if you want pvp focused rewards then you simply gotta pvp. Just like how when you are a pvp player but need to grind those tall tales for the gold curse, we just sucked it up and done it.
When we finally got it, it was earned and not cheesed. Thats my take on it.
If they make it easier i wont complain but i think i see why it is the way it is.They eventually made the check point system for the Tall Tales. In doing so you could use a 2nd account to save the final points in the Tales.
I completed each Tall Tale 1 time and saved the final check point on an alt Xbox account. Pop in with my PC main account 4 more times at the final check point and gold curse was cheesed.
Either way I don't find the level 100 curse a grind. I've lost over 350 to 400 matches while watching TV in the evenings when I'm without my crew. I'm level 56 in Servants. Point is that they make things grindy expecting it to be content for people.
People nowadays will meta the hell out of anything and take the fun out of it.
@mouse-n-keybord said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
@shadow20642 said in Increase Allegiance for Losses OR Make Every Allegiance Level Require the Same Amount? SBMM Bad?:
Im not sure about everyone else. But i feel the grind towards 100 is like the new pirate legend. Its deliberately long and they want you to have mostly wins but its so when you finally get in the hideout you feel like you earned it.
Fortunetely you dont have to do it alone either. Find a crew and do it together.
I think if you want pvp focused rewards then you simply gotta pvp. Just like how when you are a pvp player but need to grind those tall tales for the gold curse, we just sucked it up and done it.
When we finally got it, it was earned and not cheesed. Thats my take on it.
If they make it easier i wont complain but i think i see why it is the way it is.They eventually made the check point system for the Tall Tales. In doing so you could use a 2nd account to save the final points in the Tales.
I completed each Tall Tale 1 time and saved the final check point on an alt Xbox account. Pop in with my PC main account 4 more times at the final check point and gold curse was cheesed.
Either way I don't find the level 100 curse a grind. I've lost over 350 to 400 matches while watching TV in the evenings when I'm without my crew. I'm level 56 in Servants. Point is that they make things grindy expecting it to be content for people.
People nowadays will meta the hell out of anything and take the fun out of it.
I never actually thought about doing that and i gotta say thats pretty impressive haha
@shadow20642 funny you say that cause my daughter wanted to play SoT the past couple days and I got Game Pass Ultimate for $1. Perfect time to get my friends their gold curse with that alt account.
@mouse-n-keybord said
People nowadays will meta the hell out of anything and take the fun out of it.
To be fair, I would argue people of any age, background, etc does not have unlimited amounts of time to be spent on any 1 particular game. So the seeking of "meta" ultimately saves on time spent otherwise. Personal individual intent aside.
If I can save an hour doing this, that's more time to doing that.
I dont think it takes the fun out so much as it more efficiently uses time for said fun.
