PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1

  • Jacknife Wilson
    Marauder
    Insider

    Though disagreements and argument shall always prevail on these forums and on this topic. I've put together a small side-by-side to highlight three major arguments that annoy the Hades out of me relating to crossplay and poor console functionality. Primarily, I cover mobility (Fluidity of motion) in game, macro loading/unloading barrels, lack of input options on controller, and the mythical double-shot macro people whine about.

    I do not cover face-to-face pvp in this first video. I have to actually find time to get the xbox to myself and away from others in the family first. I also need to find a crew of "obviously" PC pvp opponents to fight against. PvP face-to-face is a huge complaint in the console arena. I don't take this first video very seriously because it's only remarking on low value arguments.

    PvP.... face-to-face? That's an epic argument on these forums.... I want to do the conversation justice and not simply slap a side-by-side together on that topic.

    So, without further ado, here's the video. Note the text isn't well timed, I should've left some of the text overlays on for longer, I'll adjust that in round 2.

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  • KattTruewalker
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder
    Deckhand

    @blooddoll22

    Just want to say a huge thank you for taking the time to make this video and highlight the instances between the two platforms which might be a cause for concern, I was surprised to see how little difference there was apart from the lack of hotkeys and that double gun shot was awesome haha! makes note to use hotkeys more often although I do love my cutlass lol

  • Archangel Timmy
    Legend
    Insider

    Appreciate the video and look forward to the rest you happen to make on this subject.

    I believe the complaint about the double gunshot isn't that it is impossible to do on the controller, it is that it can easily be scripted on PC to a single keystroke. So it is more of an issue with macros really, not specific to the ability itself.

  • Jacknife Wilson
    Marauder
    Insider

    @katttruewalker Glad you liked it, I really need to get the Face-To-Face pvp videos made though. That will really showcase the biggest arguments we've seen on the forums with actual evidence of it's affect on gameplay versus the thought experiments we dance around verbally. I know I learned two major things in my poorly made video filming experience: There really is a certain fluidity of motion on PC (but it's not tragic as most seem to imply during casual play again not discussing f2fPvP "yet") that console can apply as well, just not as simply. Also, I learned that the lack of controller hotkey options thanks to simple limits on the number of inputs... really is obnoxious. With practice using the controller it's not that bad... but it is a reality that is worth note to be honest. Otherwise, I really haven't felt yet that the differences between the two are that notable - yet. We will see soon.

    On an aside: The Xbox controller method for double shot is simply "Trigger", "swap", "trigger". On the keyboard and mouse I tried creating a macro to perform the function. It didn't work. It allowed me to more quickly fire then input the command to swap weapons... but the timing of the 2nd firing input wouldn't allow the weapon to fire UNTIL AFTER I spaced the second firing command to exceed value of assigning it to a macro in the first place. It was done in the video manually by using default controls of: "Left mouse:, "Flick the scroll wheel", "Left Mouse". So despite form factor... it's three distinct inputs that behave equally fast and actually rely on that slower 'human speed' to compensate for the animation needs.

    Same with the barrels. It's awkward to "claw" the controller when trying to both move and loot from barrels but it can be done. But when simply placing or unloading items the speed is regulated by the games inventory accounting. It simply doesn't matter how fast you hit the input ... items are loading into or out of inventories at a rate timed by the coding.

    And yea, if you watch close. Sensitivity 10 on controller... really moves very much like KB+M at high DPI (My DPI is set at device default "high" with option to slow it down by two other stages). The biggest difference is how we access the buttons on a KB versus a controller. But that's a matter of player acclimation more than anything! My son for example is tragically bad at using the KB+M layout as he's used to controllers in this game.

  • Nefrit Od
    Master
    Insider

    @blooddoll22

    First of all if you comparing something show us stats on both side
    Fox Xbox 1x its:
    HDD 1 TB SATA III / 5400RPM (!)
    RAM 12GB of GDDR5 @ 6.8GHz
    CPU custom 8 core 2.3GHz (!)
    GPU Custom GPU @ 1.172 GHz

    And you didn't give us any info about your PC except GPU which is showing only graphic in game.
    Second you should know (or at least google) that 5400 rpm hard drive is slowest stuff in a world in 2018 (and thats why its take much longer to load on Xbox then on SSD PC or even good HDD), do not even compare it to SSD on PC, my loading time in game take about 10 second and that even with my bloody i5-3470 :D

    What i'm trying to say thats this video not enough to compare
    and it should not be compared.
    Good PC is MUCH faster then any console. In loading and running and even clicking and aiming :)

  • Jacknife Wilson
    Marauder
    Insider

    @nefrit-od and, as I predicted this would come up...

    Here ya go:

    Intel Core i7 7820X (8-core, 11MB Cache, 4.5GHz)
    2TB (64MB Cache) 7200 RPM SATA 6Gb/s
    64GB Dual Channel DDR4 at 2400MHz
    NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070 Ti with 8GB GDDR5
    Mouse DPI set at 3400 otherwise:
    Tech specs for mouse:
    Sensor Pixart3389
    DPI Range up to 16000 but again only using 3400
    USB Report rate up to 2000HZ (Unmeasured)
    Tracking speed 400CPI
    Acceleration 50G
    Left and Right mouse buttons rate up to 50M CLICKS
    11 programmable buttons

    My monitor is garbage... a uPnP I had leftover since ages ago so I leave the default FPS cap with v-sync at 60 but I'm sure I don't need too.

    So why shouldn't it be compared now that the stats are revealed? Are we trying to discuss data flow rates or how the "faster" and the "slower" systems really only have 5 major differences (Which the video actually HELPS highlight):

    • Rotation and camera movement speeds
    • Easier in the real world to hit fewer buttons (thanks to macros) but in game no functional difference
    • PTT voice chat vs manual changes
    • An inventory scroll wheel thanks to lacking input options on controller.
    • Faster transitional load times

    Your right of course, most "proper" PC's will load the game faster and transition from black screen with great haste. This is an optimization issue that the devs have been working on since forever (How hard? upon this topic I cannot say). It needs improvement on the console side.

    PC is faster...

    Yet you've failed to see what the video means to highlight which doesn't demand HAL to compare:

    Input speed for inventory collection are limited by the game itself, the fastest macro in the world won't provide much faster item pick ups, a split second at best. The biggest nuance here is that unless players are crab clawing their controllers to allow camera movement and button hits they can't as easily move and collect. There is a need to pause briefly to pick up more than 1-2 items unless you premeditate movement. Again, simply using the controller in another way can overcome this. Items themselves... they don't go into the inventory any quicker - the game prevents that.

    Then there's the FPS cap on console - that deserves to be looked at and increased presuming the hardware can manage.

    Even with faster clicking and faster aiming which will vary from user to user, even on console, button inputs simply do not allow faster input than the game universally permits. Gun-swap-shot is a perfect example of that not only can it be done on controller without effort... doing it faster thanks to macro's actually breaks the action and interrupts it. You simply cannot pull it off at any faster a rate than effective. Even if you manage to shave half seconds off the timing... the shots will affect any player just as well as another.

    Bear in mind also that KB alone is what affects all movement other than camera direction. Hitting a keyboard button to shift left or right, forward or back, or even jump isn't effectively faster than using a controller. Only facing and camera position is affected. The difference is in the rotation of the character and camera direction. And as noted in the video on the console side, slider at 10 compensates more than enough to allow players to turn and rotate to hit the idiot who might have hopped over their heads. Though even I think it should be improved by a degree so that upon landing the stationary jumped over player can have rotated 180 at least.

    Jumping as well...hit the jump button a thousand times a nanosecond and your not jumping and sooner or later than anyone else as the game won't allow it. Though even I would hope for the slider to widen on console a bit more perhaps by half again to 15 rather than 10 because even I prefer a bit faster camera movement.

    I haven't showcased PvP face-to-face yet, and though I will since it's a point of contention, to be honest unless I open up my FPS cap and place my mouse DPI at max it's really a useless showcase (and thanks to monitor limits and my poor performance at max dpi it'd be even more useless). That's why I didn't even bother in 'round 1'.Not to mention the other BS such as finding a crew when I'm on console who have maxed their hardware and are competent in PvP to allow that sort of comparison as well.

    A good pc is faster than console but rotation and fluidity of motion are the only notable alterations in the game to be sure. Yes I can run and even hop and turn easily. The controller does keep up albeit with sliders at 10 (which should be widened, I agree). All button inputs match despite the PC's ability to allow for single press laziness. But even with single press laziness, the actions in game aren't faster or alter the flow of play in the least.

    There is ONE MAJOR argument, rotation.

    If someone is stretching... then we're talking about perhaps the idea that it only requires one button if a macro is used to accomplish a variety of movements such as swapping to a wooden plank and holding to repair or G-d knows what. That's a factor that doesn't actually affect the alacrity of play in a validly measurable way. A controller user can accomplish with same action in the rough same span of time even if they have to hit 50 buttons to do it. Sucks for them but it doesn't affect play.

    There's also the notice of the inventory wheel... I agree... that sucks, but again, overcome once your practiced with it.

    I actually wish I was on a weaker system. Mine is hardly the best but it works well. At least with a weaker PC we could see that at least one player doesn't 'have it easy' and might struggle to keep up even with Xbox. Which really is the point isn't it.. that despite the potential hardware advantages on paper, the effective advantages are thin, nowhere near the attention given to the conversation.

    Even my pal who does run his game on a garbage minimum setting pc and brings in at best 15fps average and 300+ ping with a $10 mouse and 19 inch monitor... STILL has an even playing field with the exception of rotation and camera angle, a benefit which does nothing to aid him against a console player who at least has their sensitivity at 10.

    We loot as fast
    Change weapons as fast
    Steer as fast
    Drop sail as fast
    Jump as fast
    We don't turn around equally, and we can be lazy and combine buttons on one even if it's not faster, and we lack a need for the inventory wheel generally. That's it.

  • ChalkyHotDog
    Founder

    @blooddoll22 Why not include the standard Xbox in your comparisons as used by the majority. There's a lot of poor gamers.

  • Jacknife Wilson
    Marauder
    Insider

    @chalkyhotdog That's a great idea! Overall because the default input actions occur at the same general measure regardless of old vs new version xbox:

    It didn't take long to realize that, "hardware be darned"... with certain exceptions (Rotation and Camera angle) input/action devices are limited by the software and prevent much of the arguments we read about issues such as cross play losing to speed macro's etc.
    So in short a player on the oldest Xbox using a controller versus someone with HAL-7billion is actually going to have the same general in game effect on play with the exception of rotation/camera and inventory wheels. Yet even then the difference isn't game-breaking. Though I'll always admit controllers deserve a higher threshold limit.

    To be fair the slider for controller really does deserve another x1.5 increase in top sensitivity, and a dead zone slider would be nice even if not specifically needed. But the game is far from unplayable or broken despite the lack once sliders are set to max.

    PvP is a really difficult subject for me to showcase and display because as I've said before... it's soooo subjective. I could film players who totally blow chunks at the game but clearly play on PC, which would only showcase "me vs them", or the reverse equally ueless. My biggest worry in the video and in this thread is the question:

    What are the limits on PC advantage? how much does it really affect gameplay where the rubber meets the road versus on paper? What are the notable control driven differences? Do macro's matter? And so on.

    I'm not sure my PvP video will really succeed in showcasing the issue but Im'ma make it anyhow. So yea, to answer the question again but more directly... I didn't use an older model Xbox because the control schemes and inputs are fundamentally the same across console using default in box items. Even if graphics and fps may be weaker.

    Now if we're showing off FPS, graphics, garbage like that? Yea specs and each type of system will make a gigantic difference. But if we're showing the lack of appreciable disparity even when using buttons and macros .. the need isn't there.

  • Admiral RRRSole

    @blooddoll22 Wow, great comparison. I must admit that I was shocked by how little the difference is and what a load of garbage the argument on use of macros prove to be in this game.

    Nicely illustrated.

    Also thanks for not firing on the galleon first. lol
    I'll make a peace-loving placid pirate out of you yet. :o)

    I had to laugh at one of those sniper shots from the bowsprit which was at right-angles to you. I want to PvP that dude, Capt' Cockeyed. lol

    About Megs, Don't forget the galleon was firing upon her so her mood was already set.
    I can showcase 100 video encounters where she simply circles the boat and swims away.

  • BRlKS

    If this is not an issue then why does it keep coming back? Because it IS an issue. It is very noticeable from the console side of gameplay. It is so noticeable that console players are now bringing this thread back to life over and over and over.
    They should put an asterisk next to every win a PC players gets. Or better yet, segregate the player base. If the PC player base dies, other then the PC players, who cares? Rare already has their money. Xbox player base is substantially bigger and is the only player base paying to play.
    PC is pay to win, no skill needed. And if you are losing while playing on PC at all, then you are VERY, VERY BAD.
    PC= CHEAP EASY WIN
    Deep down you know you pay to win because you can’t win on a level playing field. That’s just sad. If you play on PC you should be ashamed of yourself for not having any real skill. Your platform is easy mode.

  • Nefrit Od
    Master
    Insider

    @blooddoll22

    • This is an optimization issue

    No its not about optimisation, yeah they can make it faster but ssd vs. hdd allways win.
    And i watch video its fine, if you are not trying compare uncomparable.

    BTW Sea battle on video is just useless, you fighting vs. noobies they don't know how to fight sloop on a galleon, they don't know how sworddash mechanic work, they bad at shooting and positioning, they don't even know that first of all they should raise sails and do 'The Siege mode" if sloop is so aggresive.

    I was playing on a sloop with randoms who using xbox game pass and they were new to game but they not reading anything about it they just rolling in with no skills at all.
    So i need to show them which rope what function, how to sail into wind, how properly steer the ship and etc.

    At the beginning you wanna compare hardware with loading
    then you comparing controller to mouse and kb
    and after all that you fighting noobs :)
    Not a PC vs Console sidebyside comparison - at all :)
    No harm just facts.

    And yes PC is stronger then console = my opinion
    and yes im playing on PC but i have few friends who playing on xbox and in pvp they as much good as i am on pc even with lower sens.

  • Nefrit Od
    Master
    Insider

    @brlks написал в PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1:

    PC is pay to win, no skill needed. And if you are losing while playing on PC at all, then you are VERY, VERY BAD.
    PC= CHEAP EASY WIN
    Deep down you know you pay to win because you can’t win on a level playing field. That’s just sad. If you play on PC you should be ashamed of yourself for not having any real skill. Your platform is easy mode.

    Thats an awfull thinking. PC no skill needed ? You probably acusing every pirate that sunk you as a cheater.
    Coz of this thinking there are so many "git gut" and "l2p".
    Skill needed in everything.
    And "cheap" pc can be much worse than xbox1x on hardware part.

  • ElectricApe

    @blooddoll22
    Great job of playing down the issue & not really showing anything that xbox players have complained about. I could do the same & make it look like the pc has a huge advantage, so what are you really trying to prove?
    You are an advocate of keeping crossplay as it is & will do anything to keep that 'small' advantage, so no Xbox player is going to listen or believe your results.
    It has been done before with timings for what is the real issue 'turn speed' & CQC, but i'm sure you can get some of your PC buddies to assist you in making it look like there is no disparity.

    Taken from an old crossplay discussion

    **Special note 2: Both of my test cases are on my wireless network. Average Ping for xbox is unknown and Test Results were taken at about 6-6:30 PM CST
    Average Ping for PC was between 77~120 and Test results were taken at about 8-8:30 PM CST. This stated because "Prime time" could have effected results.

    ***Test results were taking while playing solo unless otherwise noted
    Data taken from 1st generation xbox one:

    Full Turn (360 degrees) (default sensitivity 5)
    Average Time to Turn = 2.432 seconds

    Full Turn (360 degrees) (Max sensitivity 10)
    Average Time to Turn = 1.193 seconds

    1/2 Turn (180 degrees) (default sensitivity 5)
    Average Time to Turn = 1.251 seconds

    1/2 Turn (180 degrees) (Max sensitivity 10)
    Average Time to Turn = 0.751 seconds

    *Death Respawn times (from Death animation, until i can move again in the real world.)
    *Special note: Ferry of the Damed door timer seems to chime at 32-33 seconds after death, and you can move through the door about 35-36 seconds after death.

    Death while docked at an outpost:
    Average Full Respawn time = 1 minute 18.5 seconds

    Death while sailing at sea:
    Average Full Respawn time = 48.75 seconds

    Data taken from my PC:

    Full Turn (360 degrees)
    *Average Time to Turn = 0.588 seconds

    1/2 Turn (180 degrees)
    *Average Time to Turn = 0.397 seconds

    Death while docked at an outpost:
    *Average Time to full Respawn = 58.75 seconds

    Death while sailing at sea:
    *Average Time to full Respawn = 59 seconds

    Death respawn time while playing with my friend on a duo sloop
    Average Full respawn for me = 1 minute 1 second
    Average Full respawn for friend (whos PC is wired to network) = 48-50 seconds

  • GURU TUGINMAPUD

    @BRlKS

    They should put an asterisk next to every win a PC players gets. Or better yet, segregate the player base. If the PC player base dies, other then the PC players, who cares? Rare already has their money. Xbox player base is substantially bigger and is the only player base paying to play.

    "If a player base dies who cares as long as it isn't mine"-An adult failing to see how childish this sounds.
    At least i hope you're not an adult with this line of thinking because yikes.

  • Admiral RRRSole

    @brlks said in PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1:

    If this is not an issue then why does it keep coming back?

    The issues hasn't resurfaced as much as been proven wrong based on facts not assumptions.

    They should put an asterisk next to every win a PC players gets. Or better yet, segregate the player base. If the PC player base dies, other then the PC players, who cares? Rare already has their money. Xbox player base is substantially bigger and is the only player base paying to play.
    PC is pay to win, no skill needed. And if you are losing while playing on PC at all, then you are VERY, VERY BAD.
    PC= CHEAP EASY WIN
    Deep down you know you pay to win because you can’t win on a level playing field. That’s just sad. If you play on PC you should be ashamed of yourself for not having any real skill. Your platform is easy mode.

    Really? Why do so many of you think that everyone on PC have the latest and greatest gaming systems? Could it be just because it's easier to accept defeat believing such nonsense?

    I have a PC using the minimum video to be able to play he game with a 1GB graphic card. I consistently run between 15 to 20 fps, Xbox runs on 30fps.

    To emphasize my "PC advantage" even more I have a 19" monitor as opposed to your how many inch 4k family TV?

    Although I have a 7200rpm HDD and I believe Xbox has 5400, I do not have SSD.
    My mouse is a standard $10 item as is my keyboard.
    In other words, the typical family PC.

    Stop assuming all PCs are super powered microwave ovens on steroids. I don't need to wear a welding mask and leather apron to operate it. It will not make me blind and sterile.
    It can't even play "State of Decay 2" or "Forza: Horizon 3" on this system.... but every Xbox can.

  • Nebenkuh

    @guru-tuginmapud
    Have you seen most of the "arguments" made in these kinds of threads?
    I don't think there are many adults partaking at all.

  • ElectricApe

    @personalc0ffee
    That video shows nothing important or any of the real issues xbox players have.
    It is just a lame attempt at a PC advocate trying to disprove the disparity.

    And of course, load times & turn speed are only a MINOR issue, what a joke!!
    Forced crossplay is a complete farce! EVERY other crossplay game knows there is disparity between the systems that cannot be balanced, so they split the servers to make it fair.
    Are you trying to tell me that every other crossplay titles development teams got it wrong?? Did they all just separate pc & xbox becasue they wanted to?? No, they separated them because they know there is no way to balance the 2 different control schemes.

    You PC players can argue til you're blue in the face to keep your advantages, but the facts are there!!

  • GURU TUGINMAPUD

    @nebenkuh I have and i mean i...i just, hoped that for once i'd log into the forums and not see 20 negatives posts where people argue and yell for ages then move onto the next thread.
    Sometimes i wonder if this is all it will be, anger and toxicity.

  • Nebenkuh

    @electricape
    Did you ever stop to think that crossplay is pretty hard to develop, and most other crossplay titles probably started out as regular titles with crossplay added as an afterthought, whereas SoT was meant to be full crossplay pretty much from the start?

    Also, honest question, what would you do if Rare would announce they are now working on making crossplay optional, but it will take at least a year?

    @GURU-TUGINMAPUD
    Sometimes i wonder if this is all it will be, anger and toxicity.
    Nah, it will also be a distinct lack of logic, reason or compromise. :)

  • ElectricApe

    @personalc0ffee
    Hahahaha, what a joker! There aren't any!!! That's why Rare is apparently 'looking into the disparity' or why MS keeps stating that servers should be separate if xbox gets kb+m support, or because every other crossplay game knows there are issues between the 2.
    This is the problem with this forum & this community, people like you try & shut down anything you don't agree with, even if you look stupid, offend people with thinly veiled 'git gud' posts or even resort to getting other members banned.

    Also, I can only get as good as my xbox & controller allows, if i want to compete fairly i'll use my pc with kb+m

  • ElectricApe

    @nebenkuh
    If Rare stated optional crossplay would be 1yr, then that is when i would start playing SOT again ;)

  • Admiral RRRSole

    @electricape said

    You PC players can argue til you're blue in the face to keep your advantages, but the facts are there!!

    What advantage? Didn't you read anything about my system?
    Which facts, where? Did you view the video whilst wearing a blindfold?
    I've posted several videos here displaying my frame rate.

    Show us evidence / hard proof that will discredit the video proof shown. Make a comparison video yourself. Give us the proof of "facts" you mention.
    Don't just say "it's heaps easier on PC" or that "PC is 10 times faster". That's just hear say BS that we've all heard hundreds of times in dozens of threads here already.

    Oh, and let's not forget the macro BS which has also been dis-proven. And to think, I was actually believing that there may have been some merit to that c**p.

    But yeah by all means, continue to close your eyes and place your fingers in your ears whilst repeating "La la la la" whenever solid proof is put before you. Because gawd forbid so many whiny disgruntled console players can't possibly be wrong.

  • Nebenkuh

    @electricape
    So you're not even playing SoT?

  • Nebenkuh

    @personalc0ffee
    What I don't understand is how they can be so sure they've faced a mkb user.
    Combat in this game is not really fast paced. Hitboxes are huuuuuuuuuuuge. There are no headshots. Everyones positioning is extremely predictable. Every gun has 1 shot before needing to reload. Cutlass aoe is pretty big. Blocking range is very large.
    Even a faster turning rate and precision should barely make a difference with these buffers in place.
    And then there is sooooo much more to the game before it ever gets to CQB. Honestly, if you end up in CQB as a defender, you've allready messed up. If you board, you should have the advantage because enemy crew should be busy repairing and bailing...

    Also, I've been playing since release and did a lot of PvP, and I've met maybe 2-3 guys who were obviously on PC, based on their jumpy-spinny stuff they were doing. Everyone else I couldn't tell from their playstyle.

  • Arrmaro
    Marauder

    @electricape said in PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1:

    And of course, load times & turn speed are only a MINOR issue, what a joke!!

    Yes, because they are different between different PC setups and vary between different Xbox versions, so using that as an argument to disable crossplay isn't valid.

    Forced crossplay is a complete farce! EVERY other crossplay game knows there is disparity between the systems that cannot be balanced, so they split the servers to make it fair.
    Are you trying to tell me that every other crossplay titles development teams got it wrong?? Did they all just separate pc & xbox becasue they wanted to?? No, they separated them because they know there is no way to balance the 2 different control schemes.

    Just highlighted something you've said

    You PC players can argue til you're blue in the face to keep your advantages, but the facts are there!!

    You can "disable crossplay screamers" can argue til you're blue in the face but crossplay isn't the issue. As you said yourself, it lies with the controller scheme.

    If there should be any special servers, it should be based on input device.

  • ElectricApe

    @admiral-rrrsole
    I posted the timings m8, they say it all.
    No xbox players have any issues with what was shown in the video, so was a bit pointless really!
    The 'macro thing' hasn't been disproven at all, OP just didn't set them up correctly or use the correct software, i can set them up fine on my mouse ;)
    Why not go on all the other crossplay game forums to try & argue your case & educate all the console players & other game developers & try to prove that they are wrong, I'm sure you'll be met with open arms!!

  • ElectricApe

    @nebenkuh
    Most ship battles end by being boarded, so CQC is the be all & end all.
    Turn speed is a HUGE factor in this scenario & is what the main issue is!!
    Why is that so hard for PC players to comprehend?

    & no, at the moment i refuse to play SOT as it is not a finished game & not a balanced game!
    After chucking over 1000hrs into alpha,beta & pioneer testing i really don't see the point until the disparity is solved one way or the other!

  • ElectricApe

    @aarghmaargho
    As it stands all the kb+m players are PC players, minus a tiny amount that may be using an XIM, so the issue IS crossplay.
    A controller can never be balanced to behave or respond like a kb+m, so it CANNOT be balanced. Hence why all other crossplay games make it optional, because they know it can't ever be fair!

  • ElectricApe

    @personalc0ffee
    I'd like to see the boot on the other foot!
    As soon as there are any things the PC community don't like they chuck a hissy fit to get it changed & the devs straight away roll over & change it!
    The EOR sens was one that springs to mind straight away. You lot found it unfair & screamed & shouted until it was changed. The xbox community didn't get up in arms about it & argue on every thread about it!
    Many have stopped playing & many more will too, because they acknowledge there is a problem & because nothing gets done about it they stop playing, but at least you're happy so that's fine.

  • ElectricApe

    And just for anyone who wants to spout it doesn't really matter as this isn't a competitive game, have you even looked up the definition of the word game?

    GAME
    (noun)
    a form of competitive activity or sport played according to rules.

  • Arrmaro
    Marauder

    @electricape said in PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1:

    @aarghmaargho
    As it stands all the kb+m players are PC players, minus a tiny amount that may be using an XIM, so the issue IS crossplay.
    A controller can never be balanced to behave or respond like a kb+m, so it CANNOT be balanced. Hence why all other crossplay games make it optional, because they know it can't ever be fair!

    "all the kb+m players are PC players" but not all PC players are KB+M players.
    You're not looking to balance the game, you're looking to have the game made easier for yourself.

    As of right now, yes KB+M is only on PC. But seeing how Microsoft and Razer are developing it for Xbox and are aiming to release it this year it would be stupid to disable crossplay now and have the same discussion again within 5 monhts.

    If you want to balance this, you should balance it with the future in mind and how the game and systems will develop. Don't balance it in a short minded way that isn't open for improvements and how the future of gaming is developing itself.

  • Arrmaro
    Marauder

    @electricape said in PC vs Console side-by-side (non pvp focused) comparison part 1:

    And just for anyone who wants to spout it doesn't really matter as this isn't a competitive game, have you even looked up the definition of the word game?

    GAME
    (noun)
    a form of competitive activity or sport played according to rules.

    1 An activity that one engages in for amusement or fun.

    ‘the kids were playing a game with their balloons’

    1.1 A form of competitive activity or sport played according to rules.
    ‘the game of cricket’

    1.2games A meeting for sporting contests.
    ‘the Olympic Games’

    1.3gamesBritish Athletics or sports as a lesson or activity at school.
    ‘in order to be popular, you had to be good at games’

    1.4 The equipment for a game, especially a board game or a video game.
    ‘buy your games and software from us’

    1.5 A person's performance in a game; a person's standard of play.
    ‘Rooks attempted to raise his game to another level’

    Atleast use the right context if you want to use definitions.

  • Arrmaro
    Marauder

    @electricape
    The EOR complaints were from the entire community, not just PC.
    The weapon sensitivity sliders got added as a quality of life change for ALL players. Every player, Xbox or PC, has benefited from it.

  • ElectricApe

    @aarghmaargho
    Making it easier?? Well, yes, i suppose it would be easier if it was fair!
    But as i said you cannot balance kb+m vs controller.
    'Expecting' to release it this year!! So could be this year, could be next year, may never happen!
    Not going to make much difference anyway as console players use controllers & many won't want to change & learn to use keyboard & mouse & gain muscle memory to be 'on par' with pc players.

    We shouldn't have to change our ways to suit pc players, we are the majority, PC are guests on the xbox network, but still you think it has to be 'the pc way'.

  • ElectricApe

    @aarghmaargho
    but when there is a winner & a loser it then becomes competitive!
    There's no 'loser' when playing with balloons!
    the context i used was spot on ;)

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