In the most recent Developer Update video on YouTube; 4:01 Joe Neate stated that "Each tool that is there; Is there for a specific purpose." Isn't this a movement/momentum glitch in the game? If it is then I'm just curious if it will be removed in the Feb, 6th update?
In my own opinion I would actually like to see it removed. Its useful, Its sneaky, and its fun. I just don't think its what the Developers intended it to be.
"Sword Swim" technique.
@lunar-craze disse em "Sword Swim" technique.:
In the most recent Developer Update video on YouTube; 4:01 Joe Neate stated that "Each tool that is there; Is there for a specific purpose." Isn't this a movement/momentum glitch in the game? If it is then I'm just curious if it will be removed in the Feb, 6th update?
In my own opinion I would actually like to see it removed. Its useful, Its sneaky, and its fun. I just don't think its what the Developers intended it to be.This is like PUBG Pan, a "glitch" that become part of the game.
@targasbr Is it though? Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never seen one of the developers use the so called "Glitch" in any of their livestreams.
@lunar-craze disse em "Sword Swim" technique.:
@targasbr Is it though? Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never seen one of the developers use the so called "Glitch" in any of their livestreams.
I do not remember where I've seen them speaking this, but if I'm not with bad memory, I've seen them talking or someone told me they said it. I do not know to give you certainty.
@lunar-craze said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
@targasbr Is it though? Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never seen one of the developers use the so called "Glitch" in any of their livestreams.
I always see the devs. use it. It is part of the game and it makes sense, works and is a great tool. Enjoy it.
@targasbr You see! That is what I'm getting at. The Developers haven't given it any highlight. For all we know they have forgotten about it, or they are debating having it removed right now. Its all up for debate.
I would like to add, that this technique is one of the mechanics that needs experience to not miss in battle or any other situation that needed timing, boarding a ship for instance or anything else.
If you want to get rid of it, it means that players would need to take more risk and it makes the game pacing a little slower.
I don't imagine them taking it away, mostly because for a whole year they left it there and now the main topic is not even the sword but the famous double gun.
Like i said the pacing would be affected as players get more experienced and if compare to other games pacing there would be a huge difference.
Just try it for one hour without the sword technique and see if you still want to get rid of it. I would certainly do less than i do right now and certainly want to keep it as it is.
I personally wouldn't mind if they removed it. The pacing of the game does need to be slower. I don't think it needs to speed up at all.
The mobility of it is fun to use but honestly, when do you use that? To get aboard a ship, to jump somewhere incredibly high that you should not be able to jump from and land in the sea to speed to you boat, or to leave the boat to the island. And in all 3 of those situations is something that you really shouldn't be able to do, you know? I get that it fun, but it is a pretty bad exploit of the physics engine.
It takes little skill to be able to master and use it to get to another boat so I really wouldn't try bringing up it takes skill to use. And this is me personally, but I don't think you should be able to sword lunge off a mountain and take no damage cause you exploited the game and was able to gain massive air and speed to hit the water, nor do I think someone should just be able to sword lunge from their deck to get that insane momentum and speed to cut through the water to your boat. If you want to try and board you will have to cannon and hopefully land on the deck or position your selves good to be able to drop a man off and swim over.
There is a achievement for shooting yourself onto another deck. Only 5% of gamers that play the game have it unlocked. It just shows you how much of a reliance the community uses it to board.
There needs to be a much more stronger emphasis on having naval combat. Removing that, would make naval and ship vs ship combat much more stronger and the crews would have to rely on stronger teamwork and coordination to achieve victory. It would take skill with being able to aim the cannons to be able to board, or skill with being able to navigate a boat and be able to lure your opponents into favorable positions for the crew to be able to feasibly be able to jump off and swim there.
@shinten-rai said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
There is a achievement for shooting yourself onto another deck. Only 5% of gamers that play the game have it unlocked. It just shows you how much of a reliance the community uses it to board.
Or that just says that landing on the deck of a ship with a cannon shot is hard to do. The best method to board using the cannon is to shoot in front of the ship and hope you can grab the ladder which won't earn you the achievement. Shooting onto the deck of a ship is hard at long distance, and a lot harder at engagement distance where it is more likely to result in you waiting for a mermaid after you skip over the deck or fail to hit something that will stop you.
@d3adst1ck All the more reason to get rid of the sword lunge, because that is hard. You take away the sword lunge and then the cannons is all they have which will make people have to just get better at shooting them. Which in turn will make more skilled players and naval engagements will be much more tense and fun.
@shinten-rai said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
@d3adst1ck All the more reason to get rid of the sword lunge, because that is hard. You take away the sword lunge and then the cannons is all they have which will make people have to just get better at shooting them. Which in turn will make more skilled players and naval engagements will be much more tense and fun.
I imagine you'll just end up with more ship rams, because that will still be easier than using a cannon.
@d3adst1ck Possibly. But at the same time, you would be able to maneuver away from a ram unless you were docked at a island.
I doubt you would see many successful ram attempts out in open waters in a fight between two ships. I think the majority of ram attacks would happen if you were caught unawares, and then that is kind of you and your own crews fault for not noticing the galleon or brig bearing down while you were parked at a island.
@shinten-rai I've seen lots of rams in open waters, and have even done some on purpose or accidentally. Once it's done, might as well send someone over to deal with the other crew since 1) you're in close proximity to a now-slowed and/or turned ship for an easy boarding, and 2) they now have holes in their ship that you should stop them from repairing.
@lunar-craze said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
@targasbr Is it though? Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never seen one of the developers use the so called "Glitch" in any of their livestreams.
It was first found in and used in the TA, the developers heard about it and like the majority of other people loved it.
They do utilise it in there streams, the first time it was use by them I believe was when they hosted there pirate olympics. They was sword lunging from the crows nest to see who could get the furthest.I love the sword lung and to me it honestly wouldn’t be SoT without it. It’s the only thing that has stopped me joining the double gun meta, I litrally feel naked without it and would wholly riot if it was ever removed.
However the developers also said they will keep a close eye on it and the data and will make any necessary tweeks if it becomes unbalanced and ect...
@they-sank A Minecraft sword lung you say, I believe you might be onto something there!
@Shinten-Rai Please don’t say such a thing about removing my beloved sword lung! :P It has become a part of me now. XD
@d3adst1ck How did they get caught though? Anchor drop? I have yet had a ram happen in open water cause well, my sails are down, we are moving. It is hard to ram a moving target.
You also open yourself up to have the same thing happen to you as well. You will put holes in your ship and it will be in close proximity to them now as well and you now are also slowed down. And I would also imagine that unless you were able to get on their ship and drop their anchor or rammed them head on, they would just start sailing away.
Not saying to not to ram in open waters, but it doesn't really put the ship that rammed into a favorable position over the other boat. You equally take damage and then equally could be able to board if the other ship was competent and level headed during the combat and be able to seize the opportunity as well.
The most favorable position for a ram is a docked boat with their sails up. You would be able to ram them, and then it would also push their boat into the shallows which would cause more holes and then your boat would be right there boxing them in so they couldn't just drop sails. Out in the open waters, you can't really box them in. If there was grapples like in Blackwake, I would say doing a ram in open waters if you and your crew are skilled enough to be able to be able to line up a solid ram would be much better cause then you could grapple their ship and be able to hold them into place.
@knifelife Hahaha I would miss it too, but if giving it up would improve the over all quality of everything in the game and I believe it would. I don't mind having to walk down the path on the mountain to get back to the boat.
@shinten-rai In all fairness i normally fall off the mountain and break my pirates one working leg anyway haha!
For me personally I see the sword lung like shooting yourself out of a cannon, it’s just a nice qwerky (I might have just invented that word 😂) to get around here and there and shouldn’t really be taken serious. :)
@shinten-rai That seems entirely backwards to me - ramming a docked ship is just inflicting damage on your own ship needlessly. If they are docked, why not just shoot them? They aren't moving.Ramming a ship on the open seas is situational. Sometimes you will be on even footing in regards to damage and potential boarders, other times you won't be.
I was simply commenting on your assertion that the low percentage for the cannon to deck achievement was somehow related to there being a sword lunge ability in the game. They aren't related as even without the sword lunge, I imagine the number of boarding attempts made directly onto the deck by cannon would be extremely low.
@knifelife Well I respect your opinion but I think it should be taken serious. I also view it as shooting your self from a cannon. Which is why to me it is a problem. You can do it anywhere that is solid. With the cannons, it takes proper ship alignment and a good know how of how to aim and then you are limited to static horizontal and vertical angle with the cannons and must rely on the captain to keep you in range.
You might not travel as far or as fast, but being able to essentially shoot yourself out of a cannon anywhere on solid land is a problem in my book. Now granted, you would have to hit the water to get any of the big buff it has cause if you just jump and lunge but don't hit the water well you traveled a bit! But not really as far.
@d3adst1ck Cause if you ram them, you will push them into the shallows and make it even harder for them to maneuver out and cause even more damage. You would cause the same damage to your own boat if you did it out in the open waters as I believe it is how fast you hit that determines how many holes you get not so much where, so you essentially get even more damage for free and then depending on the skill of the crew, you would be able to board them and pepper them with cannon fire and they would be stuck on the shallows, making recovery even harder.
But on topic, I feel that it is related slightly. As me and @KnifeLife were talking about in the same thread. A lot of people view being able to sword lunge in the water as shooting themselves out of the cannon and it is much easier to do so as well, which then I think prompts more people into not trying to cannon over at all even to grab the ladder but sail in close enough to sword lunge range cause it also makes no noise as well. You would be able to hear a cannon go off and know that fire or boarders are coming. Which in turn makes less people want to try to board via cannon. In my opinion at least.
@shinten-rai I do see your points, but for me I’m just wholly biased towards the sword lung, to be honest i don’t think I ever really use it to board ships as if I am in a fight and we are side by side we are usually all in the cannons.
But that’s just me and I will admit im very biased towards sword lunging haha i don’t know why but I just fell in love with it the first time I was shown.
@lunar-craze said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
@targasbr Is it though? Correct me if I'm wrong but I have never seen one of the developers use the so called "Glitch" in any of their livestreams.
They may have not used it on their videos, but they do indeed know about it.
Like anything developmental side, the devs that actually play their own video games are quick to catch on to anything that's unintended.
The sword surfing is one of those things that was not by design, but does not actually harm the game play, so it's not been patched out because its no game breaking.
Thing is, Sword Surfing very well may only be in game not because of any other reason than to fix it could break something else..
A totally made up example of what I am on about is this.. Perhaps say for example there are a pair of trousers in game that have a totally strange texture map, and for no good reason either, it's not the texture map picked out, and in the next patch its updated with the correct "proper" texture map..
Unknown to us when we launch that this change to the texture map now causes banana eating to glitch and for no good reason at all when you're facing south and eating a banana your game client freezes and you cant get back on Sea of Thieves for 1 hour and 14 min....... No real obvious reason why other than that texture map change............ It was literally the only thing changed and some how as if by Russian space magic is banana eating when facing south now a bug..
That's just how these things are, and it's a case of "If it's not broken don't fix it"
I would direct your to the problem solving flow chart, but it would likely get me banned by posting it due to profanity that's used, but I assure you it's appropriate for the situation at hand.
Stop calling it a glitch or bug. It is not a malfunction of the game, it is an interesting interaction between game elements. It has been classified as a feature of the game, that was discovered by play testing before the game came out even.
It is even a characteristic feature of the game at this point. It has literally been in the game since launch and Rare is very aware of it, liked it and decided to keep it as a feature.
Some of the most iconic features in games are created by the interactive nature of the elements within a game. It is a common practice within the industry. This has been happening since the beginning of game development and will continue to happen till the end of time. Not everything in the world is created at a drawing table.
Stop trying to create the false sense of it needing to be fixed, just because you don't like it.
Stop misusing terminology, it is so frustrating.
The "Sword Swim" is one thing but there's also the En Garde Lunge which allows a lot of unintended features (they're not all easy to pull though expecially on Xbox) :
- Super jump
- Normal speed while lunging and ability to jump.
- Cooldown cancelling
- Bunny Hop (after the super jump)
- Visuals bugs (animation not showing on client side, I don't know it it shows on othere players)
I'm probably missing some features.
I've seen Rare doing the Sword Swim but I never saw them doing the En Garde Lunge + jump for example (but maybe I missed it).
I don't mind for the moment, but I hope, that in the future, Rare will have a look at it and make it "clean" even if it is to officialize those features.
So do you think Rocket jumps should be removed from most FPS games? It was never intended that way.
Should stealing cars be removed from GTA? It was never intended in this game.
Should Ghandi not become an angry nuke throwing leader after enough people adopted democracy in Civ games? Because it was never intended that way.
@hynieth
"Should stealing cars be removed from GTA? It was never intended in this game."GTA stands for Grand Theth Auto, it is literally the act (and crime) of stealing vehicles on a large scale. It is literally what every single GTA game has been about (aside from running over pedestrians).
Also Ghandi is like that in CIV games because he was literally programmed that way. It WAS intended that way. Who would want a chill Ghandi in a game about war and taking over countries?! It's a great comedic aspect for the game, to have a super chill dude act like a complete ***. It's a way of making famous figures interesting and fun in a PVP game.
Also I don't think rocket jumps have been a thing, for almost a decade. xD
The only games that really had it were really c****y games with unrealistic logic and physics. You don't see people doing it in BF5 or COD. If you fired a rocket under yourself you'd just die. In fact I can't remember a single FPS where rocket jumps were a big thing. It was certainly a thing in some game, because the now slowly dying "RocketJump"YouTube channel has been named after that very thing. But it certainly wasn't a thing across many FPSs.GTA was Called Race 'n chase during its development and involved just running from poliece, but the game evolved into GTA because of bugs. It's one of those games where a bug during development caused the game to be what it is now.
Ghandi had an agression score of 1 or 2 or at least so low that if players chose democracy and caused the agression to dip below 1 it would go back to 99 making him agressive again a bug that became a feature.
In quake Rockets had impact and propelled players away, this was quickly picked up by players who exploited this to reach places they should not have reached, thus rocked jumping was a thing.
IF you try to disprove something please for the love of all check your facts first.
@shinten-rai said in "Sword Swim" technique.:
I personally wouldn't mind if they removed it. The pacing of the game does need to be slower. I don't think it needs to speed up at all.
We don't need to speed it up, because we have the sword dash. It makes the game more fluid and better paced.
The mobility of it is fun to use but honestly, when do you use that? To get aboard a ship, to jump somewhere incredibly high that you should not be able to jump from and land in the sea to speed to you boat, or to leave the boat to the island. And in all 3 of those situations is something that you really shouldn't be able to do, you know? I get that it fun, but it is a pretty bad exploit of the physics engine.
It isn't an exploit, it is an accepted feature of the game which has been in it since day one.
It takes little skill to be able to master and use it to get to another boat so I really wouldn't try bringing up it takes skill to use. And this is me personally, but I don't think you should be able to sword lunge off a mountain and take no damage cause you exploited the game and was able to gain massive air and speed to hit the water, nor do I think someone should just be able to sword lunge from their deck to get that insane momentum and speed to cut through the water to your boat. If you want to try and board you will have to cannon and hopefully land on the deck or position your selves good to be able to drop a man off and swim over.
- Having it not being a super high skill cap ability makes it available to all. Keeping the game more fair.
- Jumping of a mountain or stone with a lunge doesn't mitigate the damage, it is the ability to land in deep water. It just increases your range not anything else.
- Boarding has different ranges and uses: Cannon for medium/long, Lunge for medium/short, jump off for extremely short aka ram.
Removing the medium range option will not improve naval positioning, it will result in more ramming or drawn out fights and more fleeing. Currently naval positioning is based on more aspects to consider and is more difficult due to it, which increases complexity and skill cap. Isn't that what you want? It makes it easier to dominate people with bad positions and more risky when someone is good at the helm. If you miss you are in the water.
There is a achievement for shooting yourself onto another deck. Only 5% of gamers that play the game have it unlocked. It just shows you how much of a reliance the community uses it to board.
I use the lunge all the time, I primarily drive or board and I have hit decks with cannons often enough. Actually cannon over is just as common as lunges.
Don't want them to board you by lunge, use naval positioning as you suggest it should be about: Naval combat. I can circle brigs on a solo sloop with people trying to get on board with it and having no issues with them missing the ladders every single time, due to my positioning.
There needs to be a much more stronger emphasis on having naval combat. Removing that, would make naval and ship vs ship combat much more stronger and the crews would have to rely on stronger teamwork and coordination to achieve victory. It would take skill with being able to aim the cannons to be able to board, or skill with being able to navigate a boat and be able to lure your opponents into favorable positions for the crew to be able to feasibly be able to jump off and swim there.
I believe the importance of boarding has little to do with the lunge. That is just one of the ways to approach boarding.
It already is the case that you have to navigate yourself into position to land a boarding crew, be it by cannon, lunge or stepping aboard.
You want to reduce the options, which in my opinion reduces the teamwork and coordination required to achieve it. Requiring less ladder defense, have more predictable movements of your opponents and less options for your crew.
@hynieth I don't want to be that guy, but you're telling me to check my facts if I try to disprove something, while you yourself aren't giving any sort of proof to back up your statements.
Also the bug in "Race n' Chase" had nothing to do with stealing cars. It was the AI constantly ramming into the player, which the developers found really funny so they kept it and changed what the game was about. The original still gave you the option of being a robber, which I'm pretty sure also involved using cars that didn't belong to you.
Here's a video talking about the bug: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoCl4i35dQ8
And here's a short article: https://funfactz.com/computer-facts/gta-race-n-chase/There, I checked my facts, happy?
Also you're not really proving me wrong with the last paragraph/statement (if that was your intention). I did say there was probably a game (a single game) and you confirmed that by saying it was quake. I never stated it was never a thing, I stated it wasn't a thing throughout many FPSs which you seemed to think (the opposite of what I just said) by the way you worded your previous post.
@lunar-craze I’m a simple man...keep it in the game. It’s caused no harm and plus reduces time to get back to the persons shop without having to swim for 15 seconds.
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