Addressing the "Double Shot"

There have been several discussions about this in other threads. I have said before and still believe that a solution to this is simply to make it so one of the weapon slots can only be a sword. You can chose which sword you want, but you can only equip a sword to that slot. When you picture a swash buckling pirate, you picture a sword fight. So I believe it would go along with the pirate story much better.

@vulgrim1911 said in Addressing the "Double Shot":

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Totally agree.

Oh yes and even yesterday they were discussing how they should make guns do less damage when fired point blank and more from a distance (because that makes sense lol).

Double gunning is a strategy that takes a lot of skill to get good at. It is terrible for anything other than boarding (for the most part). You can't sword lounge or even block incoming slashes from an attacker. If you miss, you're probably going to die in many situations.

So what is peoples problem with it? For one you must not be good at it and have probably never spent time working on it. Stop trying to change the rules of the game because you're too lazy to get good at it.

Also, explain to me why you shouldn't be able to shoot of two guns quickly (it's definitely not "instant" btw)? Guns were all one shot back then. So shooting 2 or more off in quick succession would have been a thing. Wasn't it Blackbeard or something that would carry 6 pistols on him into battle?

All that this would do is make gameplay feel even less responsive than it already is. The people who were getting beaten senseless by better player would continue to be beaten. You can't think that somehow if they got rid of double guns that you would suddenly be this great player. Good player are just good, regardless of the weapons available.

@i-mileson-i In programming and electronics it is a simple concept called DEBOUNCING.

I submitted a but report about hot swapping and the need to debounce weapons ages ago. It went ignored basically. It takes very little work to implement debouncing in a game. If done properly, you would do the entire debounce on the client-side, but verify that it has taken place on the server-side. Doing that keeps people from "cheating" the system... and more than doubles the work required, but is the "right" way to go about it. After dealing with the way patches and new additions go with this game it is highly likely that we will never see this change. It is also likely that if we do, it will be client-side only...and a bunch of people running something as basic as Cheat Engine will just be bypassing it.

I cannot think of a modern title that allows hot-swapping...except for this one.

@vulgrim1911 I play a ton of competitive first-person shooters. Your response of "get good" doesn't fit here. The problem is it doesn't take much skill to pull off this technique and the animations for firing are clearly bugged. We shouldn't be promoting and defending exploits like this.

@sanni It makes no sense. No one should be able to instantly fire a shot from two separate guns before the other player can even take a step. The knockback locks you in place, you if you land the first shot you're guaranteed to land the second.

I would like to be able to double-shot BANANAS!

That is, I would like to eat a banana and then not have that 'nana-consumption fail because I take a step forward, or equip something else, or f**t, before the animation has ended.

@el-dunco said in Addressing the "Double Shot":

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Wow, how vindictive.

You see, this is really what I think it boils down to here, vengeance. I think people that couldn't win against higher skilled players are coming here to try to rewrite the rules to get back at them. They want to take away the tools that others have mastered because they themselves can't be bothered to master them.

@dawson-dev That's not the case at all. It's too easy to pull off. I can pull it off and have to great affect, I just believe it's a mechanic that is ultimately going to hurt the longevity of the game. It's not about being "casual" or "bad at pvp" it's about people finding an exploit in the game's code and using it to their advantage.

I can count the times I've been killed by this technique on the fingers of one hand. The main thing is to move. For this to work your enemy is going to have to no-scope you with the EoR and that takes a fair amount of skill. It's a gamble for them too because if they miss one shot they have about 6 seconds of reload animation before they can attack you again. Also draw your cutlass and they are as good as dead. A slash interrupts their reload and you will never run out of ammo for your blade.

@i-mileson-i said in Addressing the "Double Shot":

@sanni It makes no sense. No one should be able to instantly fire a shot from two separate guns before the other player can even take a step. The knockback locks you in place, you if you land the first shot you're guaranteed to land the second.

You can't "instantly" shoot off two guns. You shoot one, switch, and then fire the other.

After the first shot the player will be knocked back like 4 or 5 feet; making the second shot harder to land. There is no "locking" component to gun knockback (swords have it though).

So this whole "instantly fire a shot from two separate guns before the other player can even take a step" is completely inaccurate. Maybe you should actually try it out for yourself and see how it works for you.

@dawson-dev I have.

@m1sterpunch In 1v1 encounters it's easy enough to dodge the initial shot, but generally speaking, it's not just a single offenders engaging in 1 on 1 combat. When a galleon boards your ship and 3 guys are spamming the double shot there is pretty much nothing you can do.

@dawson-dev The accuracy of the second shot hitting after connecting the first is like 95% as you are lifted off the ground and lose mobility if they connect with the EoR as the first shot.

@i-mileson-i said in Addressing the "Double Shot":

The accuracy of the second shot hitting after connecting the first is like 95% as you are lifted off the ground and lose mobility if they connect with the EoR as the first shot.

The knockback makes it LESS likely they will hit with the second shot. And I've never seen more than one person in a crew able to perform that "doubleshot" reliably. It's not a viable technique because if you miss you're dead in the water. I think you've just had bad luck with your server and will probably never encounter that crew again.

@i-mileson-i if you're point blank, and the other person isn't moving, then yeah, you're probably going to hit both shots. But that's part of the weakness of double gunning; you have to be right next to someone for it to be very effective. Not to mention that you're done for if you miss.

I love the double shot. I can't pull it off to save my life (lol) , but hats off to those of you who can! I've tried a few times but I get frustrated and end up switching to my go-to pistol/sword combo.

I will say this though. You can't say that double-shotting is "one shot" when you've literally said it's double lol. If you are continuously moving in combat, it is very hard for someone to double shot you. Not impossible, I know some guys who are extremely good at it, but here are a few tips:

The double shot is usually sniper followed by pistol. The sniper shot is often a no scope, followed by pistol, which is why it's so fast. So keep your distance. Don't let anyone get too close to you. If someone has to actually scope in on the sniper to hit you, there is going to be a delay between that shot and the pistol, giving you time to get behind cover and eat a banana before that second shot, and now that double shotter has to reload and you have the window to counter.

The only one shot in this game is a close range Blunderbuss shot. Again, keep distance to avoid that. The key to any strat is knowing how to counter it, not asking devs to nerf everything into oblivion.

@vulgrim1911 BOOM! [Mod edited] Anyone can double gun, it just takes lots of practice.

@dawson-dev It's easy to pull off. The complaint isn't "I can't do it, so it's stupid!" The complaint is anyone can do it so it makes pvp interactions boil down to "who can pull of this exploit first" and that isn't going to lead to long term growth of the player base.

This attitude is terrible and completely against the spirit of the game. You can defend the exploit if you want, doesn't change the fact that it is in fact an exploit.

@vulgrim1911 Dude your attitude is just negative and gross. Don't come in attacking players who are pointing out an obvious exploit in the game's code.

@i-mileson-i double gunning is extremely difficult to do well. It is not easy, by any means.

If you get the jump on someone and have time to get behind and two-tap them. Then sure, that's easy. But if you fighting multiple people at once, it's a whole different story.

You can't even defend a ladder if more that one person try to climb up it.

You have to use a whole different strategy and play style to be successful with it. It is by no means a game breaker.

One person with a pistol and a sword has taken out me and my crew before. Many of us had double guns and we were cut down by masterfully timed sword lounges. You don't see me crusading for a sword lounge nerf do you?

When you're facing players that are much better than you are it often feels unfair; like you didn't have a chance. This is not a result of people exploiting the game, but rather, mastering it.