Make it so that if you die like 3 times in like 1 or 2 mins you have spawn invulnerability
Make spawn camping hard
@mintharp184509 said in Make spawn camping hard:
The ferry door opening faster means deaths are less punishing. This translates to crews getting about double the opportunity to break a spawn camp and recover than they once had. To me this is an improvement.
On paper maybe to some but in the reality of the environment is it's a devastatingly imbalanced change with what actually happens out there.
It gives campers more kills for thrills, it's not changing the outcome in a large majority of camping situations it's just giving campers more to play with.
on the other end it's terrible for the smaller ship/crew that is already at a disadvantage. Pressure and luck mean less now. Less underdog wins.
All around terrible change for the environment imo.
@wolfmanbush said in Make spawn camping hard:
@mintharp184509 said in Make spawn camping hard:
The ferry door opening faster means deaths are less punishing. This translates to crews getting about double the opportunity to break a spawn camp and recover than they once had. To me this is an improvement.
On paper maybe to some but in the reality of the environment is it's a devastatingly imbalanced change with what actually happens out there.
It gives campers more kills for thrills, it's not changing the outcome in a large majority of camping situations it's just giving campers more to play with.
on the other end it's terrible for the smaller ship/crew that is already at a disadvantage. Pressure and luck mean less now. Less underdog wins.
All around terrible change for the environment imo.
it would only make it slightly more fun. most spawn campers just get off to the idea of making other people mad... you don't really need more respawns for that.
if rare were to make a major gameplay decision like respawn times based around spawn campers (who are a fraction of a fraction of the community) that would be very stupid. I'm not a fan of the respawn times for different reasons, but spawn campers isn't a good critique of them.@mintharp184509 @CaptnCarmichael
The game is going to see what it always sees when they make a move that effects the underdog negatively
More and more running and more and more red sea plays
less productionIt's not some mystery why running amplified around chain shots being low effort and abundant and repeatedly feeding into server hopping pvp with features
More running is coming. More red sea. Less loot.
These fights are more and more pointless for the middle of this game with these types of changes.
Why would a smaller ship/crew that focuses on pve with loot have any interest in fighting a crew with no loot in an environment that stacks against one and towards another when it comes to combat?
They don't and they won't.
The amount of pressure and performance an underdog currently needs to pull off with this change is ridiculous. They are just going to run more and get camped more when/if they get caught.
Mass running is an effect of an imbalance in the food chain risk/reward system. An imbalance that is due to the features and tinkering that put more struggle on pirates already struggling.
What it could be doesn't matter, what matters is what is. Effects happening right now, effects that are long lasting. Get more to run now and they will stay running.
@rougual said in Make spawn camping hard:
The new respawn time is already an extremely big buff to fighting off spawncamping, id just take the W because all the players who like to tuck and board are already taking a big L from it.
I'd prefer if the respawn timer was a little longer/reversed but you can get bananas while on the ferry.
tucking still happens but it's far less common to run into organically than when it was at its peak.
It was largely replaced with hop/ambush/immobilize/camp
the patient crafty and creative plays are dwindling
@wolfmanbush said in Make spawn camping hard:
@rougual said in Make spawn camping hard:
The new respawn time is already an extremely big buff to fighting off spawncamping, id just take the W because all the players who like to tuck and board are already taking a big L from it.
I'd prefer if the respawn timer was a little longer/reversed but you can get bananas while on the ferry.
tucking still happens but it's far less common to run into organically than when it was at its peak.
It was largely replaced with hop/ambush/immobilize/camp
the patient crafty and creative plays are dwindling
I like to do these sorts of things, but my friend, whom I play mostly with, is incredibly blood thirsty and I never get to :(
But, yeah, they really are. I think the last time tucking was common was when Athena Runs were introduced. God, that was fun…
@mintharp184509 said in Make spawn camping hard:
@wolfmanbush said in Make spawn camping hard:
@mintharp184509 said in Make spawn camping hard:
The ferry door opening faster means deaths are less punishing. This translates to crews getting about double the opportunity to break a spawn camp and recover than they once had. To me this is an improvement.
On paper maybe to some but in the reality of the environment is it's a devastatingly imbalanced change with what actually happens out there.
It gives campers more kills for thrills, it's not changing the outcome in a large majority of camping situations it's just giving campers more to play with.
on the other end it's terrible for the smaller ship/crew that is already at a disadvantage. Pressure and luck mean less now. Less underdog wins.
All around terrible change for the environment imo.
I strongly disagree with your sentiment. The fights are better now. I just think larger crews should have a longer door timer.
Something like +3 seconds per crew member.
solo sloop - 17 secs
sloop - 20 secs
brig - 23 secs
gally - 26 secsNah. There have been plenty of times where I have waited for my teammates to go back at the same time to try and slay out...but...have lost to spawn campers anyways. Scuttling is best option. Hurts pride but it is what it is. Everyone needs to be ok with sinking. Besides...it doesn't really fix the swiping of spawn points with swords. You can still easily camp someone auccessfuly if you wanted.
@mintharp184509 said in Make spawn camping hard:
They could tweak the trident to be less useful for spawn camping.
With respawns how they are I wouldn't
tridents can be equalizers for solos
as a solo a crew that is decent or skilled is camping me overall once they secure it, that doesn't really change even for solos much more skilled than me. Whether they use sword, gun, or trident that outcome is almost always staying the exact same
but I've secured a lot of victories as a solo with tridents against larger and more skilled crews.
I still think that it's very silly that the "balancing" they did with the trident was nerf it against the meg and kraken while leaving it so powerful as a pvp tool and as a event tool but at this point I would leave it. I think it makes the environment more fun and more interesting.
amazes me how many people think this change is good for the underdog. it isn't. yes you get more chances to break the spawn camp but if your getting spawncamped in the first place your probably not the better crew. which means your anchor and mast(s) are already knocked down and quicker respawns also means your enemy is back quicker. do you think you can raise your anchor and then a mast, patch and drop sails before the people you killed, who probably didn't die at exactly the same time so you have even less time before the first is back are back ? the answer is no
also if you are the underdog in say a sloop vs galleon battle its even harder than before to actually win the fight. the first thing you do when you respawn should be to bucket if your taking on lots of water, doesn't matter if you die straight after. this just makes fights so much longer against people with half a brain.
this change is an underdogs worst nightmare.
@greatfailure82 said in Make spawn camping hard:
amazes me how many people think this change is good for the underdog. it isn't. yes you get more chances to break the spawn camp but if your getting spawncamped in the first place your probably not the better crew. which means your anchor and mast(s) are already knocked down and quicker respawns also means your enemy is back quicker. do you think you can raise your anchor and then a mast, patch and drop sails before the people you killed, who probably didn't die at exactly the same time so you have even less time before the first is back are back ? the answer is no
also if you are the underdog in say a sloop vs galleon battle its even harder than before to actually win the fight. the first thing you do when you respawn should be to bucket if your taking on lots of water, doesn't matter if you die straight after. this just makes fights so much longer against people with half a brain.
this change is an underdogs worst nightmare.
It's definitely changed my solo playstyle from "sometimes engaging sloops/brigs when I have loot onboard" to "run and drive-by sell/rowboat sell before engaging." I will have no problem engaging an aggressor with my own empty ship, ever. They would need to rebalance larger crew respawn time to get me to change again. It is absolute common sense to not engage as a solo with loot onboard currently, regardless of skill level, outside of another solo (but can't verify that until it's too late)
@greatfailure82 said in Make spawn camping hard:
amazes me how many people think this change is good for the underdog. it isn't. yes you get more chances to break the spawn camp but if your getting spawncamped in the first place your probably not the better crew. which means your anchor and mast(s) are already knocked down and quicker respawns also means your enemy is back quicker. do you think you can raise your anchor and then a mast, patch and drop sails before the people you killed, who probably didn't die at exactly the same time so you have even less time before the first is back are back ? the answer is no
also if you are the underdog in say a sloop vs galleon battle its even harder than before to actually win the fight. the first thing you do when you respawn should be to bucket if your taking on lots of water, doesn't matter if you die straight after. this just makes fights so much longer against people with half a brain.
this change is an underdogs worst nightmare.
this just makes fights so much longer
it also drags on the negative and replaces the frustration
instead of being fired up on the ferry now people are just going to get killed more which really is more opportunity for the negative possibilities that go along with a camp, mainly escalation in a situation that is known for producing a lot of it.
@roronoa-w01f
If they're camping you for supplies, parlay and give them a storage box to make it less painful (Or scuttle).
If they're camping as trolls, scuttle.
All done?I understand where you're coming from but you have to think a little bit bigger than that. Spawning back with invulnerability isn't the best counter and something like that has the possibility of being abused due to possibility resulting in the player having permanent invulnerability in other words a feature like this could possibly create a GODMODE glitch that players could abuse. I think rare needs to introduce a new mechanic, item or some new addition into Naval Combat that creates less incentive for the opposing crew to board.
For example, say if you sunk an enemy ship without boarding there would be an increase in REP and GOLD value as well as other rewards for doing so.
And these rewards wouldn't be awarded if your in an alliance with the other players
and there would be a timer after leaving the alliance before these bonuses could be awarded.
Now the reason I suggest this is in order for some of these things to work and encourage pvp and reward for taking on the challenge of fighting other crews there needs to be a limit on what the alliance flag feature can give.
I also think rare needs to add some sort of game mode for new players to go in and practice pvp because right now the only way to get better at pvp is to hunt player ships in adventure. Its fun to do but for new players thats not always the case even when arena was still in the game it really wasnt a good way to learn pvp if you didn't have a group of friends who played sea of thieves to play with.
Honestly its different for everybody but ya those are my thoughts.I believe the best way to handle spawn camping might not necessarily be to buff the defense, but rather to nerf the offense. Make it take longer and more of a distraction to anchor the enemy ship. Make it a lot riskier when you die on an enemy crew ship, either with longer respawn timers if you had boarded an enemy ship or with a disadvantage when it comes to being revived by a crewmate while on an enemy ship. To help the sloops out, maybe make it harder to disable a sloops mast or anchor, but most of the "buffs" should be on nerfing the boarding crew.
I think that if you are getting outplayed by an enemy crew that has boarded your ship, and you are unable to successfully fight back, they should absolutely have the advantage on you when it comes to positioning on your ship upon your arrival from the Ferry of the Damned. The game should reward a successful boarding, but with that advantage in positioning, there should be a tradeoff with a higher risk of faultering and losing that advantage.
I don't find this much of a problem.
If someone managed to board you and get passed the easily capable ladders and somehow killed you all or successfully dropped the anchor, that can also be easily blocked by crates/chests etc. to make it far harder to drop as the attacker, since it makes you vulnerable, by forcing you to focus/slightly stand still to get the "drop anchor interact" or to pick up a crate and then drop it, to anchor..., then you where outplayed and deserve to lose that fight or at the very least be at a disadvantage.
If the crew that got boarded re-spawns back at the same time (instead of getting killed 1 by 1 like many do in my personal experience) they already have a fair chance to recover aswell imo.
If you truly can not recover then scuttle, as you have lost the fight.
Adding invulnerability would honestly be beyond stupid and would just make boarding bigger ships harder.
@grogheart said:
I believe the best way to handle spawn camping might not necessarily be to buff the defense, but rather to nerf the offense. Make it take longer and more of a distraction to anchor the enemy ship. Make it a lot riskier when you die on an enemy crew ship, either with longer respawn timers if you had boarded an enemy ship or with a disadvantage when it comes to being revived by a crewmate while on an enemy ship. To help the sloops out, maybe make it harder to disable a sloops mast or anchor, but most of the "buffs" should be on nerfing the boarding crew.
Interesting... 🤔
@roronoa-w01f
Not invincibility, but giving 50% Health Regen after 3 DeathPeople will say that will break the game. Yeah Sure, Camp Killer can eat cooked meat anytime, just 25% Health Regen will avoid a double Shot Kill from a clever respawn
Dutchman ship should also give us the ability to pick our own Respawn point. Hate when we Respawn BLIND@papbra94 said in Make spawn camping hard:
@roronoa-w01f
Not invincibility, but giving 50% Healt Regen after 3 DeathNo. It wouldn't be very effective against campers, and even when it does work and your crew manages to survive, it rewards the losing crew.
@galactic-geek said in Make spawn camping hard:
All Rare needs to do is add more respawn locations. I think if enough fuss is made, they will do exactly that.
I wish this was true. Sword swiping spawn locations literally can reveal where a person will spawn before they spawn in. Not sure if that's been fixed with the new respawn timer.
Scuttling or just moving to a new server breaks a spawn camp. 100% effective.
@almtychcknpoo said in Make spawn camping hard:
@galactic-geek said in Make spawn camping hard:
All Rare needs to do is add more respawn locations. I think if enough fuss is made, they will do exactly that.
I wish this was true. Sword swiping spawn locations literally can reveal where a person will spawn before they spawn in. Not sure if that's been fixed with the new respawn timer.
Scuttling or just moving to a new server breaks a spawn camp. 100% effective.
They make it so you can't swipe and tell by sound pre-spawn.
@almtychcknpoo said in Make spawn camping hard:
@mintharp184509 I absolutely agree with the faster time to get through the door. I would be stuck on the ferry with my ship only having 1 hole and it sinking by the time I got back to it. I know I used to have a chance to save it a while ago...but somehow that disappeared over time.
Yes... getting killed is supposed to have consequences...
One hole is a bit of an exaggeration, yes?
Your words:
Everyone needs to be ok with sinking.
@grumpyw01f said in Make spawn camping hard:
@almtychcknpoo said in Make spawn camping hard:
@mintharp184509 I absolutely agree with the faster time to get through the door. I would be stuck on the ferry with my ship only having 1 hole and it sinking by the time I got back to it. I know I used to have a chance to save it a while ago...but somehow that disappeared over time.
Yes... getting killed is supposed to have consequences...
One hole is a bit of an exaggeration, yes?
Your words:
Everyone needs to be ok with sinking.
When I was killed...it was one hole at the time...I spent a lot of time on the ferry before and had no chance to recover the ship. And yes I am ok with sinking. But I do like the faster respawn.
@almtychcknpoo
Like I said, consequences. I would think that killing the crew and filling a ship with holes should guarantee a sink.
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