I find it so insufferable that all combat in this game comes down to whoever boards the enemy ship first and kills everyone with a shotgun blast. It's so absurd... what good are cannons then?
Remove shotguns
@eldarko2996 I mean the blunderbuss is a classic pirate weapon and was here since the beginning with a lot of thought put into it, I don't see why they would remove it just as they're adding 2 more weapons
There is a lot more ways to kill an enemy crew than using a blunder. As well its easy enough to prevent boarders.
I do think the 1 tap should be removed and the knock back should only apply if 50% of pellets hit, but i dont think it should be removed entirely just because its part of the meta. Especially seeing the meta doesnt really mean much since half the players who play the meta complain that the sword is too strong against them.
@goldsmen And who knows what the meta is going to change to during season 12. new weapons to shake things up
@captain-fob4141 sagte in Remove shotguns:
I don't think it needs to be removed, but the one tap kill is definitely an issue
It's a blunderbuss, a shotgun...what purpose does it have if it doesn't kill with one shot? You have to be very close anyway, so this is a non-issue...learn to avoid it
@schwammlgott said in Remove shotguns:
@captain-fob4141 sagte in Remove shotguns:
I don't think it needs to be removed, but the one tap kill is definitely an issue
It's a blunderbuss, a shotgun...what purpose does it have if it doesn't kill with one shot? You have to be very close anyway, so this is a non-issue...learn to avoid it
It could still have insanely high damage without being 1 tap, and the knock back is already a useful feature that is exclusive to the blunder, it just is a bit too much that it counts a single pellet as knock back.
The blunder could be used as a semi defensive weapon instead of massive damage if its key feature was large knock back at shorter range. It would allow double gunners to knock a sword user away and then tap them with a sniper (basically what most double gunners do now already), but with more knock back if all pellets hit.
@eldarko2996 I see you are quite new, maybe play a bit more and you'll find combat is a lot different than you think.
I certainly wouldn't want blunderbuss removed but it should not be a one tap. Let it do 80 or 90 damage if every pellet hits and you still have the knockback and spread to do partial damage if not all pellets hit so it would be still very useful but the one tap is and always has been a bit much imo. Latency further makes the blunderbuss annoying because there are times from my perspective where they are not right up on me but it one shots me anyway but from their view they probably were right on me. On the other hand I do think the one tap of blunder might be better for new players to give them some chance against better players.
@terron29 Blunders have 10 pellets that all do 10 damage, if they changed it to 9 damage per pellet then it would not be a 1 shot, but would be enough that even a pretty poorly thrown blunder bomb or another shot will most likely get you the kill. It would also probably pair well with the new double shot pistol coming as well with such a simple change.
I think we need to stop calling for nerfs constantly. The games been nerfed into oblivion, fofs are just a different flavour sf, megs don't attack, skelly ships don't repair, fod can be activated with just one activity, what's wrong with things being a challenge why does anything that inconveniences you have to be nerfed or removed, why does everything have to be easy
@rambobrad said in Remove shotguns:
@eldarko2996 I see you are quite new, maybe play a bit more and you'll find combat is a lot different than you think.
No I think they've really hit the nail on the head. The CQC skill gap at any level can be devastating. I've got 2000+ hours in the game and if someone boards my boat that's better at CQC than me it's game over. I agree, boarding (perhaps not blunderbuss in particular) is an OP META.
Being better at CQC than a crew makes naval obsolete. I've been on both sides of the "put one hole in the boat then board and ferry lock the crew" and find it equally unsatisfying on both sides. Sea of Thieves isn't Dishonored, it isn't Chivalry, it isn't For Honor. Naval should be the focus, it's what the game does best and is different from other games.
@lordqulex to be honest is's anecdotal as hell.
As same I had so much fight with very good CQC crews that wasn't able to keep naval enough to secure sink.
It's diffrent story at HG 1 vs 1 but still there I had plenty wins that occured only becuse good CQC player forgot about holes in his ship and focused too much on trying to sail me out of bonds.
From my expirence (so anecdotal too :) )
Borading is OP only when there is big skill gap or numerior gap between ships but.. naval encounter would end in same way. And there was a lott of HG lost couse I have overly boarding crewmate on ship.@lordqulex people who are more skilled shouldn't be punished... This games a flat playing field there's no stats or better equipment, there is only skill (and hacks for some) but losing because some one is more skilled then you isn't an issue with the game, people that love boarding could be saying the opposite that they hate playing against better navel crews but they don't, because losing to someone who's better then you is just how it works
@ghutar said in Remove shotguns:
@lordqulex to be honest is's anecdotal as hell.
Fair statement, agreed.
As same I had so much fight with very good CQC crews that wasn't able to keep naval enough to secure sink.
Yes, at higher levels boarding is required to secure the sink. But this is at such a high level of play we're talking about the top 2% of players, and for the rest of us boarding should not in and of itself be able to sink a ship. E.g., a pirate can board my fully crewed galleon, ferry lock the entire crew, run the ship into a rock, and sink it via that one hole. (I've done this as well as had it done to me.) This is the current state of the skill gap, the current state of the game. Now, yes, I understand that without a ranking and match-making system situations like this are inevitable, but still, I'd like to see naval be buffed to a level of danger that starting an encounter with boarding is very risky.
It's diffrent story at HG 1 vs 1 but still there I had plenty wins that occured only becuse good CQC player forgot about holes in his ship and focused too much on trying to sail me out of bonds.
One of my favorite HG strategies is ram the enemy ship from the get go, get a small hole in my front and a large hold in their side, and watch them ferry lock me until they sink. So much personal gratification from punishing their hyper aggressiveness.
From my expirence (so anecdotal too :) )
Borading is OP only when there is big skill gap or numerior gap between ships but.. naval encounter would end in same way. And there was a lott of HG lost couse I have overly boarding crewmate on ship.@rotten-rocko said in Remove shotguns:
@lordqulex people who are more skilled shouldn't be punished... This games a flat playing field there's no stats or better equipment, there is only skill (and hacks for some) but losing because some one is more skilled then you isn't an issue with the game, people that love boarding could be saying the opposite that they hate playing against better navel crews but they don't, because losing to someone who's better then you is just how it works
I'm not recommending punishing higher skilled players. The skill gap will always exist and there is nothing we can do about that, no should we. What we can do is change the rules to encourage intended game play. I'm suggesting that naval combat is what makes Sea of Thieves unique and an overwhelming majority of PvP bugs are CQC related, so Rare should lean into naval more; buff it.
Not hugely, I'd merely start with activating friendly fire from cannons. Try to board while your buds are pop-corning you about. See how that changes the META.
@lordqulex can I ask you what server are you plaing?
Caouse this stuff (overall feedback, skill gaps, crew "skill level") varies widly between regions!
Thats the whole catch for me expirence in EU servers are so much diffrent than NA! I remember that folks from my country discor use NA as easy mode HG couse even with high ping it was easier matches than Eu.
Personaly I think that they lack of spine, win in game means nothing if not won fair and square.
Edit: Forgot to add couse grog n stuff
For me and my crew most of HG fight (let say it ok place for meta and stuff) loss was from huge naval (cannon) gap.
No godlike, cqc player is good when they ponding cannonballs so fast and accuarte that ever faster bilge can't keep up. Then they board and finish this up...@ghutar the issue isn't fair and square if hitreg makes it luck based.
If the servers actually were stable and hitreg wasn't an issue, then it would actually be skill based. But when you lose because one of your shots gets regged when your opponent's doesn't its not because of skill.
Until hitreg actually gets fixed CQC shouldn't have a one shot kill weapon.
@captain-fob4141 can't argue with that! I pull the triger and then rng game of hit reg do whateve it wants.
My fair and square was about not choosing "easier" servers for HG
But again that one shot weapon is random for everybody. Same as eny other weapon I don't see issue here as USER of blunderbuss one shot depends on luck.
@lordqulex said in Remove shotguns:
Now, yes, I understand that without a ranking and match-making system situations like this are inevitable, but still, I'd like to see naval be buffed to a level of danger that starting an encounter with boarding is very risky.
I don't see how this is going to be feasible without severely impacting low skill or new players, who aren't going to be able to handle faster sinking either. In addition to sinking faster vs players, they'll also sink faster to other things too. All you'd end up doing is negating high skill CQC in favor of high skill Naval, and not really doing anything to help smooth the skill gap if that is your intent.
I do agree with friendly fire from cannons, though.
@d3adst1ck said in Remove shotguns:
@lordqulex said in Remove shotguns:
Now, yes, I understand that without a ranking and match-making system situations like this are inevitable, but still, I'd like to see naval be buffed to a level of danger that starting an encounter with boarding is very risky.
I don't see how this is going to be feasible without severely impacting low skill or new players, who aren't going to be able to handle faster sinking either. In addition to sinking faster vs players, they'll also sink faster to other things too. All you'd end up doing is negating high skill CQC in favor of high skill Naval, and not really doing anything to help smooth the skill gap if that is your intent.
I do agree with friendly fire from cannons, though.
You entirely misunderstand my intent. I never once said faster sinking. I never once said smooth the skill gap. This is a skill based game, and thus the skill gap is always going to be the steepest part of the learning curve, and the better crew will almost always win the encounter. We can't fix that, we don't want to fix that, it is part in parcel to the game.
What I want to do is encourage players to stay on their ship during the first half of the encounter. "Boarding is necessary against high skill crews." Yes, it is. I want to make opening with boarding risky. I want to make it something you do after you put a few holes into the enemy ship, not before your crew begins to fire.
There are many ways to achieve that, I've mentioned none of them. That is not the topic of discussion here.
@lordqulex said in Remove shotguns:
What I want to do is encourage players to stay on their ship during the first half of the encounter. "Boarding is necessary against high skill crews." Yes, it is. I want to make opening with boarding risky. I want to make it something you do after you put a few holes into the enemy ship, not before your crew begins to fire.
Opening with boarding against high skill crews is risky. The only times it isn't are against low skill crews or when your ship is too far away to be within firing distance before you come back from the ferry.
@d3adst1ck said in Remove shotguns:
@lordqulex said in Remove shotguns:
What I want to do is encourage players to stay on their ship during the first half of the encounter. "Boarding is necessary against high skill crews." Yes, it is. I want to make opening with boarding risky. I want to make it something you do after you put a few holes into the enemy ship, not before your crew begins to fire.
Opening with boarding against high skill crews is risky. The only times it isn't are against low skill crews or when your ship is too far away to be within firing distance before you come back from the ferry.
It's not a matter of high skill versus low skill, it depends on how wide the skill gap is. I guess it's difficult/uncommon to find equally skilled crews. I've been on both sides of it: sunk the other ship real fast with a boarder and been sunk by real fast by a boarder. I've only very rarely, using Discord LFC, had some loose cannon fire over and sank because of it. That's the nature of adventure mode, you don't know the skill level of the ship over there. More often then not it isn't a protracted battle of skill, it's win fast or lose fast.
In retrospect, all the drama and tension in the game comes from that unknown. Seeing that ship and deciding whether to risk them being better than you. Seeing the number of ships on a server and deciding to stack or sell.
What it really boils down to is fun. I've said it before, I find naval in the game fun. If you just want to give orders to your ship, go play Skull and Bones. If you want silky smooth CQC combat, go play For Honor. This is Sea of Thieves: you are the crew, you angle the sails, you fire the cannons, you repair and bucket. That is what is unique to Sea of Thieves and that is what the focus should be, in my opinion. That's why I want to nerf boarding and buff naval: there are a hundred better CQC games and this is not one.
@goldsmen Agreed. Overall I would much rather the oneshot potential of blunder was removed. It would still be a very good weapon especially with the knockback and spread.
@rotten-rocko Well I certainly agree with not everything needs nerfs but some of the things you mention are bugs like skellie ships not repairing (they do now with recent update supposedly) FOTD being activated with one activity is a massive quality of life moreso than a nerf. It means its much faster to get to the good stuff, The fort is fun, doing all the pre requisites to set it up is not. Once the fort is up you have pvp potential and the fun of doing it while keeping an eye out. Many of the updates to seas I feel just trimmed the fat tbh. Its in its best spot.
@lordqulex This is a very interesting perspective. I do agree the naval is what it does best for sure (no other game does it better) and yet I always love the risk reward of boarding and indeed if im on the receiving end the tension of potentially being boarded so though I certainly respect your opinion I think both are vital. The main issue imo is to make the CQC more interesting and varied perhaps as its not nearly as polished or fun as the naval not to mention far more susceptable to hit reg or lag.
@lordqulex oooooooh! Very interesting idea. Only thing is I find you could end up in a lot more battles that end up a battle of attrition. Who runs out of cannons first or boards. many times when fighting a team of similar skill neither ship seems to fully get the upper hand and instead it results in numerous resets. A successful board is usually what solidifies the victory for one or other in my experience anyway. That said friendly fire cannons is very interesting idea.
@captain-fob4141 Agree with the one shot kill blunder, Don't think it should be one shot BUT the hit reg has def improved in my experience. That new authoritative hitmarker setting is also a great help.
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