Sword dash exploit

Eh. I think there's opportunity for a shake-up of the sword.

The no-block lunge is super high risk because of its lack of mobility...whereas the block-lunge is just better and there no reason people shouldn't do it other than they just don't know about it.

So the idea is...Create a Heavy and Light sword lunge attack...

Light = Block+Lunge
-Enhanced mobility (like today)
-Standard Cooldown penalty for missing target
-Lower Damage to 45

Heavy = Lunge (no block)
-Reduced mobility (like today)
-Reduced Cooldown penalty for missing target (maybe 25% of the current cooldown penalty)
-Increased Damage to 85

There could probably be some additional tweaks, but I think that would add a little bit of variety and risk/reward to the sword mechanics.

_
Oh, and the interact cooldown cancel exploit should absolutely be fixed.

They patched it by nerfing it back in the day but kept it in the game as a feature.

@agraves12 you mustn’t of heard, Rare embraced this years ago so it won’t get “fixed”. I feel like your complaint comes from seeing other weapons being “fixed”.

@tesiccl I thought they only embraced the sword dash in water. And I’m pretty sure a year or two ago they said something about having plans to patch sword dash jumping which ties into patching blocking before sword dashing. I don’t remember them saying anything about embracing that part of the exploit. And honestly I think it should be patched seeing how it severely reduces punishments for missing such a strong attack, with said exploit though it almost completely nullifies all intended mechanics for the sword dash.

@bkb What exactly did they do, because I’ve never heard anything about them ever patching anything about the sword?

@sweetsandman I don’t think the mobility you get from the exploit should be a thing at all if it keeps the sword dashes knockback which is its main purpose.

@wolfmanbush Agreed the canceling of the sword dash at will at any point with no punishment combined with blocking before sword dash and many other bugs and features with the sword dash cause it to be a buggy, exploit filled, and frankly if done correctly outright op because then a heavy hitting string attack no longer has any downsides

Also I would like to point out that even though this post is about the sword dash specifically can we acknowledge that the sword’s range has been atleast tripled since launch, this causes the sword to be able to slash and sword dash through areas not intended for swordplay. If you would like me to explain further I can happily elaborate extensively about all the absurd spots and areas that I’ve tested thoroughly. For example to catch your attention sword can hit through the grate on the sloop, and you can sword dash people near the railing from the water knocking them off the boat or maybe you can hit people from the opposite side of the brig on the brigantine.

@agraves12 said in Sword dash exploit:

@sweetsandman I don’t think the mobility you get from the exploit should be a thing at all if it keeps the sword dashes knockback which is its main purpose.

Like I said, maybe there's additional tweaks needed to my idea. Like maybe the "Light Lunge" has a reduced (or eliminated) knockback. I just think there's an opportunity to enhance the overall sword gameplay.

Also...can't really call the block-lunge an exploit when Rare has flat out said it's an official part of the game (and has been for a long time).

Cooldown cancelling is absolutely an exploit and it's crazy they haven't addressed that one yet. Only the double gunners seem to get their exploits removed.

@agraves12 they can’t embrace it in one area and leave out the others, wouldn’t be possible. Considering the utility of the gunpowder weapons, I think the movement capability of the sword via lunging (which isn’t an exploit at this point considering Rare’s approval over it) is a nice balance.

@sweetsandman I want to know when they announced they were okay with this specific exploit because I only heard about the speed boost in water being green lighted. Because I swear I heard them say stuff about wanting to patch sword dash jump.

@tesiccl So is sword dash jumping atleast 2/3 of the way across the brigantine and wiggling your camera left and right hitting everything like a tidal wave then just to grab cannon and get no repercussions balanced?

@sweetsandman fair enough

@tesiccl said in Sword dash exploit:

@agraves12 you mustn’t of heard, Rare embraced this years ago so it won’t get “fixed”. I feel like your complaint comes from seeing other weapons being “fixed”.
I would like to say that I was literally a sword user and a good one at that for 6 years straight and only started double gunning for the last year and a half so I never used quickswap nor cared.
But even while I used the sword I knew it suddenly became quite a bit more powerful than any other weapon once they increased the range so much that I could then hit over map table. Also while using sword didn’t care for quickswap users as all I had to do was not walk in a line and just sword hop.

@agraves12 never seen an interact button pop up during the cool down phase of the dash after I’ve dashed, so not sure what you’re referring to. Before the dash yes you can cancel it and that’s fine in my eyes.

@agraves12 said in Sword dash exploit:

@sweetsandman I want to know when they announced they were okay with this specific exploit because I only heard about the speed boost in water being green lighted. Because I swear I heard them say stuff about wanting to patch sword dash jump.

Oh gosh many years ago. Like year 1 I believe.

@tesiccl said in Sword dash exploit:

@agraves12 never seen an interact button pop up during the cool down phase of the dash after I’ve dashed, so not sure what you’re referring to. Before the dash yes you can cancel it and that’s fine in my eyes.

You can absolutely cancel your missed sword lunge cool-down by interacting with a cannon/harpoon/wheel/ladder/rigging. You can do this anytime during the charge up as well as up until your lunge has completed (and missed).

Ladder guarding with the sword lunge is a great example. Charging up on your lunge and you realize they aren't where you thought they were going to be when you thought they were going to be there? Just grab the wheel, cancel the remainder of the animation, and start again.

It's absolutely an animation cancel exploit and should be removed as it completely eliminated the risk/reward of missing your sword lunge...but it's the sword...so...they probably won't touch it.

@sweetsandman

during the cool down phase of the dash after I’ve dashed…

Absolutely aware of what can be done before, but after that? Interactions are disabled during cooldown as far as I’m aware.

@tesiccl said in Sword dash exploit:

@sweetsandman

during the cool down phase of the dash after I’ve dashed…

Absolutely aware of what can be done before, but after that? Interactions are disabled during cooldown as far as I’m aware.

Correct, once you've entered cool-down, you cannot cancel. I misinterpreted that as "after I've started my dash" not "after I've completed my dash and entered cool-down."

All points leading up to and during your dash, you absolutely can cancel the animation.

That's the exploit. It's eliminating the risk element of beginning the sword dash in the first place.

@sweetsandman

It's eliminating the risk element of beginning the sword dash in the first place.

Personally I don’t feel like other weapons have a risk element when using them, so why should the sword with the charge and dash? Just seems slightly unfair. But that’s my opinion.

@tesiccl said in Sword dash exploit:

@sweetsandman

It's eliminating the risk element of beginning the sword dash in the first place.

Personally I don’t feel like other weapons have a risk element when using them, so why should the sword with the charge and dash? Just seems slightly unfair. But that’s my opinion.

The risks with all the other weapons are ammo constraints, and reload times, which is effectively the same as the lunge's cooldown.

The sword, while the lunge has a penalty, is otherwise infinitely spammable. Being able to cancel the only real cooldown element it has is what is unfair.

_

The block-lunge has always been odd IMO. It's not an explained mechanic at all. It's something you only learn about through other players or by complete accident. Same with the cooldown cancel.

IMO, enhancing/changing the sword mechanics as I mentioned earlier would force Rare to effectively make the block-lunge an official taught mechanic for all players.

The cool-down cancel though? Should be removed. Just like quick-swapping was.

@tesiccl You can cancel it in the stun phase within a 0.5 second time frame but afterwards it is impossible to interact with anything but if you time it correctly you can still get a bunny hop in to get further away sometimes. Also since you can cancel at any point before you can simply just realize you’re gonna miss and just cancel it long before you get to the stun phase.

@tesiccl What do you mean? Sword literally is a close range zero reload uzi with a heavy attack and if done with an exploit has zero repercussions is too weak?

@sweetsandman said in Sword dash exploit:

@tesiccl said in Sword dash exploit:

@agraves12 never seen an interact button pop up during the cool down phase of the dash after I’ve dashed, so not sure what you’re referring to. Before the dash yes you can cancel it and that’s fine in my eyes.

You can absolutely cancel your missed sword lunge cool-down by interacting with a cannon/harpoon/wheel/ladder/rigging. You can do this anytime during the charge up as well as up until your lunge has completed (and missed).

Ladder guarding with the sword lunge is a great example. Charging up on your lunge and you realize they aren't where you thought they were going to be when you thought they were going to be there? Just grab the wheel, cancel the remainder of the animation, and start again.

It's absolutely an animation cancel exploit and should be removed as it completely eliminated the risk/reward of missing your sword lunge...but it's the sword...so...they probably won't touch it.

You don’t even have to grab wheel when ladder guarding, currently if you block before sword dashing you don’t get stunned at all when hitting the wheel or the sail adjustments spots

I'd have zero issue with them patching instances where the risk can be negated - such as grabbing something mid-charge to cancel, or by hitting certain things stopping the stun.

However, the mechanic itself has been embraced by Rare and not seen as an exploit, given the [intended] trade off is that you have to commit and that you get stunned for missing it seems balanced in terms of risk-reward.

I'm going to assume this post is a veiled attempt to get other more dubious exploits back though.

@realstyli said in Sword dash exploit:

I'd have zero issue with them patching instances where the risk can be negated - such as grabbing something mid-charge to cancel, or by hitting certain things stopping the stun.

However, the mechanic itself has been embraced by Rare and not seen as an exploit, given the [intended] trade off is that you have to commit and that you get stunned for missing it seems balanced in terms of risk-reward.

I'm going to assume this post is a veiled attempt to get other more dubious exploits back though.

That is not the point of the post, the post was me merely questioning why Rare hadn’t patched the blocking before sword dashing exploit as I don’t know if Rare had greenlighted it or not, and also because I don’t think that you should be able to turn and move as much as you do when you block before sword dashing, as you are suppose to be committing to the direction but currently you can completely change course which doesn’t seem fair seeing how it hits any hit box that is barely even on screen and sometimes not even.

I'll leave you with the idea of removing the sword dash but remind you that it's also the only alternative to prevent the game from turning into Call of Duty with the omnipresent firearms. which for me sword player should not work in water to balance them.The blunderbuss sniper has been the meta in PvP for 7 years now.